Realforce 88UB (Topre 45g)

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Spikebolt
√(4) != -2

21 Feb 2015, 00:26

Hi guys, I'm here to make a small review about the Realforce 88UB (45g uniform) that I recently acquired from noobie94 here on DT. This review is not meant to be objective, it's a very personal and biased view of the keyboard. As such, I feel like it's appropriate to share a bit of my keyboard background and hopefully someone will relate to me and find this review helpful. If you just want to read about the keyboard then skip it :D

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Background

My name is Cosme, I'm 26 years old and I'm a software developer. I game a bit in my free time but I mainly type of a lot of non-sense with my keyboard heh :P
My first mechanical keyboard was a Razer Blackwidow with MX Blues a couple of years ago. Fortunately the keyboard had serious QC issues and I RMAd it three consecutive times, which in Portugal means you get your money back. This time I searched a bit more about mechanical keyboards (on Reddit, where I am now a very active visitor) and I bought a Filco Majestouch 2 with MX reds. I was in love. The switches felt super smooth, perfect for my fingers. I had this amazing feeling when typing, I didn't want to stop. Since I didn't want to carry the keyboard to work everyday, I decided to go on a quest for the right keyboard to use at work. I tried a lot of boards but none of them fully satisfied me. Everyday I would get home from work and found typing on my Filco much more enjoyable. Here's what I tried:

* Ducky Shine 3 with browns: felt like reds with sand on the stems, didn't enjoy it very much
* WASD V2 with blues: bought it very cheap on DT but since it's so noisy I decided to re-sell it for the same price
* WASD V2 with blacks: not bad, a bit too stiff for my taste but I just felt that linear was not the right choice for work
* Ducky G2 Pro with clears: I really enjoyed the bump but the switch was SOOO stiff that my pinky finger would hurt from pressing the Enter key...
* Ducky G2 Pro with 62g ergo-clears: I decided to learn how to solder and replace the Ducky's springs with a lighter one. At first it felt okay, but I still felt like it was too stiff and over time I started to really dislike the bump

I've had enough with Cherry MX switches, time to see what this Topre fuss is all about.


Build Quality

This is my first Topre board so it's hard for me to compare it against other Topre boards because, welp, I've never tried another Topre board.

When I took it out of the box I was excited to see that the keyboard was in mint condition. Absolutely no shine on the spacebar, no scratches, everything seemed great.
The keycaps are thin PBT (spacebar is ABS) and have a distinct rough texture that I really enjoy touching. I think it's cool how the Realforce provides a premium experience right from the first touch.
The board feels very sturdy and solid with no creaking or pinging noises. I really like the plastic material used in the case, it gives a clean and comfortable feel. Some people would argue that the Realforce design is boring but I enjoy the simplistic look it provides. No LEDs, obnoxious branding or anything of the sort. The board is extremely clean.
It's a shame that it has a non-detachable cable because I'd like to use my Pexon cable on it - sadly I had to order a new one. I dislike the fact that it doesn't have rubber feet on the back of the keyboard, just the front. While this isn't a huge deal it's something I'd appreciate to have. The only thing that actually annoys me is the Windows key and that plastic orb. Why?? :(
When compared to the other MX keyboards I have owned I think the Realforce is the highest build quality I ever owned, close to the Filco. Filco feels a bit heavier, which I enjoy a lot, but Realforce feels just as nice. This is a high quality keyboard for sure.

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Typing experience

Being my first Topre board and having read what people thought about it I was extremely curious: do Topre feel good or not? I was warned by Muirium that it could be a bit underwhelming at first but that I wouldn't be able to go back to MX reds.

The first time I typed on them they felt amazing. It felt like Topre had the things I loved the most in cherry MX switches: smooth(er) as MX reds and a more satisfying bump than MX clears. It's hard to explain on words what I feel is wrong with the MX clears bump. It feels like the bump doesn't have a smooth transition, it's like you drop into a shaft of sorts. Also, the increasing force after the bump makes it a disruptive experience. In Topre the bump feels right. It's smooth and subtle, yet noticeable. However this makes it really hard (for me at least) to not bottom out.

I love MX reds and really appreciate the fact that they're a very light switch. Reading that both MX reds and Realforce 88UB had 45g force, I was hoping them to be very similar. The Topre 45g feels considerably heavier than MX reds, close to blacks I would say. Whenever I get home type on my MX reds I feel like I'm smashing the keyboard, at least in the first couple of minutes. I'd like the Topres to be a bit lighter but I enjoy them non the less.

The stabilized keys are amazing, it feels as good as the Costar stabilizers but without any rattle. It's absolutely perfect.

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Sound

I've read a lot of people modding their topre keyboards with landing pads or dental bands but to me the sound is not really an issue to me. Yes, it makes a bit of sound but I doesn't really bother me. It's as quiet/loud as MX ergo-clears. My work mates don't seem to mind it so it's perfectly fine for me.
I like how Topres sound, it's quite satisfying. I really like to bang the enter key heh :P


Gaming experience

I feel like the switches aren't that bad for gaming, actually. I appreciated the tactile feedback when playing Starcraft II but not when playing Dota2 or WoW. I feel more comfortable playing with the MX reds, which was to be expected.


Veredict

I would totally recommend this keyboard because I feel it's the best keyboard I've owned so far. Typing on Realforce 88UB gave me that "I don't want to stop typing" feeling back, one that I had long forgotten. I'm really glad to have it back.

Pros:
* Good build quality, premium experience
* Topre switches feel great
* Enjoyable to type even for long periods of time

Cons:
* No rubber feet on the back
* No DIP switches
* Ugly/weird windows keys
* Low quantity of aftermarket keycaps
* Doesn't stop me from typing crap :D

zts

21 Feb 2015, 01:11

Hi Spikebolt ... nice review, but could you check on *No DIP switches* -- it should be on the back close to the USB cable.
EDIT: My bad. Seems that 88UB doesn't have DIP switches on the back. I have 87U 55g and they have it.

User avatar
Spikebolt
√(4) != -2

21 Feb 2015, 01:35

I left it at work so I'm unable to double check, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't have them. This table seems to confirm the 88UB version (ISO) does not have them.

zts

21 Feb 2015, 01:40

Spikebolt wrote: I left it at work so I'm unable to double check, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't have them. This table seems to confirm the 88UB version (ISO) does not have them.
You are totally right. The 88UB doesn't have them. 87U does.

noobie94

21 Feb 2015, 19:08

I am glad you like it :)

Kind of miss this beauty but I am happy you like it. It was sad to see a keyboard like that not being used :lol:

User avatar
Muirium
µ

21 Feb 2015, 21:31

Glad you like the board!

Beware what people say on the internet, though. Anyone who thinks 45g (regular) Topre is close to MX red is deluded. There's various ways to measure switch weights out there (the right way and the wrong way, evidently…) but in all reality 45g Topre is in between MX red and black, leaning towards black. A lot of non-MX switches are right in that range actually, it's something of a sweet spot. Most Alps switches are right around there too.

Good news: Topre makes 35g switches too. Those are indeed more like reds. Bad news: Topre doesn't make uniform 35g boards. But they do make variable weighted "ergo" models. In fact, that's the classic Realforce design!

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http://deskthority.net/wiki/Topre_Realforce#Key_Weight

You might like a variable Realforce. The lightest switches are matched up to your smaller fingers, which is just what you noticed about pressing Return. Which I notice is marked as a 45g switch on that chart, doh! Well, there's some lighter keys on there anyway!

As it happens, the forum's resident Topre expert 002 has a variable weight Realforce touring around Europe just now. I borrowed it myself, back when I hadn't tried Topre. Interesting learning experience! I wonder if I could talk him in to letting you on the list so you can compare it to your uniform 45g? Would you be up for that? You basically just borrow it for a week for free, then pay for shipping to the next guy.

Ducky Nordic (back when he was last around…) talked about commissioning an all 30g Realforce from Topre, under the Ducky name. (Like how EK and Leopold commission their special edition Realforces.) It didn't happen, but it's an intriguing idea.

http://deskthority.net/vendors-f52/duck ... ml#p187576

User avatar
Spikebolt
√(4) != -2

23 Feb 2015, 11:56

I had stumbled upon the variable weighted Realforce but what put me off was that the modifier keys are all 45g. It just doesn't make much sense to me.


I'd like to try it for a week. Even though I doubt I will get it, I would love to experience it!


noobie94 wrote: I am glad you like it :)

Kind of miss this beauty but I am happy you like it. It was sad to see a keyboard like that not being used :lol:
It's in a good home (office?) and I'm really happy to use it everyday :)
Last edited by Spikebolt on 23 Feb 2015, 15:31, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Muirium
µ

23 Feb 2015, 14:33

002 is cool with you getting a shot. His variable Realforce is between tours right now, but due a reboot. It's actually helping Matteo find a manufacturer for PBT spacebar for all Topre keyboards! A project many of us are keen to see happen.

The mods aren't 55g by the way. They're 45g like you have now. I think there's only 2 keys on a variable Realforce that are any heavier than their brothers on yours! The main difference is lighter alphas on each side.

User avatar
Spikebolt
√(4) != -2

23 Feb 2015, 15:32

Fingers crossed for that PBT spacebar!

Yes, you're absolutely right. Fixed the major typo.

User avatar
Spikebolt
√(4) != -2

05 Mar 2015, 19:11

Just a quick update on this review.

It's been almost a month since I've got the Realforce 88UB, it is easily my favorite keyboard now. I still really enjoy typing on it and it has increased my performance at work: I no longer complain when I have to produce documentation hehe :P

This board has seriously grown up on me on when I get home and type on my reds I no longer enjoy it, at least not as much. I miss the Topre feeling when I get home. I'm now considering buying a new Topre board for home typing and keep the reds for gaming. Aw god whyyy.

zts

06 Mar 2015, 08:49

Spikebolt wrote: ... This board has seriously grown up on me on when I get home and type on my reds I no longer enjoy it, at least not as much. I miss the Topre feeling when I get home. I'm now considering buying a new Topre board for home typing and keep the reds for gaming. Aw god whyyy.
Yep, Topre stuff is addictive. It starts with an initial *meh* and quickly progresses to the feeling of awesomeness to *I need a Topre backup keyboard ... just in case* :D

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