SA Dasher & SA Dancer keycap sets (Completed)

SL89 · 06 Oct 2015, 23:52

Apologies, I meant that that HBG image that Mu so kindly linked, and whip up TWO batches. One for Dasher, and one for Dancer, both following the template of that 'Deluxe' set we can use as the jumping off point!

The Filco and ISO full board images would be fine compliments as well. But they are secondary.

Also, right on with the close enough colorway. If anything it might make these pop as they look more like a modern interpolation of the colorway.

niomosy · 07 Oct 2015, 00:32

zslane wrote: ↑The color codes are listed in the first post (on the spec sheet graphic). BFK and BFN are the two blue shades I chose. BBQ has too much green in it for me.

The next step is to come up with the kit manifests along with renders of each. Then it would need to be submitted somewhere for a more formal interest check. But apart from posting about it on geekhack, the choice of GB agent would largely determine where that IC happens. Should it be through PMK? MassDrop? [Ctrl]Alt? All I know is that I don't want to manage a group buy myself; that will need to be someone else's job.

Interesting as the renders tend to look more BFQ or BBJ on the light blue and possibly BDH on the darker blue. Looking at the Pulse set, I can see a bit what you're talking about with BBQ.

If the renders are a close replica of what we're looking at, all good. In any case, it's a beautiful blue set and since I'm a massive fan of blue, I'm happy.

zslane · 07 Oct 2015, 00:40

SL89 wrote: ↑The Filco and ISO full board images would be fine compliments as well. But they are secondary.

Renders of the bare keycaps in "kit" arrangements are the first order of business to be sure. However, renders that show the keycaps "in context" (i.e., as they would appear in an actual keyboard) have a seductive power that shouldn't be underestimated. I think those renders will be the ones that sell the set; the kit renders will merely give buyers confidence when they order.

zslane · 07 Oct 2015, 00:51

niomosy wrote: ↑
zslane wrote: ↑The color codes are listed in the first post (on the spec sheet graphic). BFK and BFN are the two blue shades I chose. BBQ has too much green in it for me.
Interesting as the renders tend to look more BFQ or BBJ on the light blue and possibly BDH on the darker blue. Looking at the Pulse set, I can see a bit what you're talking about with BBQ.

If the renders are a close replica of what we're looking at, all good. In any case, it's a beautiful blue set and since I'm a massive fan of blue, I'm happy.

It should be noted that all the color representations seen here are rough approximations at best. I don't have any of SP's color chips to sample for RGB values. The photographs of the color chips on SP's website are useless as a true color reference. But I have to start with something, so I have taken the RGB hexcodes from http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com's color chart for Signature Plastics ABS colors and encoded them into my Keycap OTL.

So what you are seeing are the http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com color values rendered through the linear color pipeline of Houdini's PBR render engine, given a minor gamma shift, saved out as a minimally compressed JPEG image, and then displayed on your monitor. We are all seeing minor variations of #1a8ab7 (BFN) and #005190 (BFK). I'm pretty certain that none of them match the actual color chips faithfully.

For now we have to be content with rough approximations. However, if someone has properly calibrated RGB values for all the color chips, by all means send them to me and I will update the OTL and get out some new renders.

Hypersphere · 07 Oct 2015, 00:55

@zslane: Your 3D renders look great.

You might also be interested in checking out the new SP web site, which features a number of keysets in various profiles and styles:

http://pimpmykeyboard.com/all-products/

zslane · 07 Oct 2015, 01:44

Yeah, I've been to see it. I'm glad it is up and running again, though I hear that bugs in the ordering system linger.

I do plan to take a fairly thorough survey of all the kit offerings from various sets to try and come up with a collection I am comfortable with.

zslane · 07 Oct 2015, 02:00

SL89 wrote: ↑Like it or not, this is your baby zslane and if you want to see it done right, you might as well do it yourself. This is how knowledge / experience are built after all, and waiting for a champion to come and take this out of your hands is an excercise in futility.

You are probably right. We'll see how much stamina I have for all this...

SL89 · 07 Oct 2015, 02:09

This is what makes it a 'Group Buy' we all can work together.

niomosy · 07 Oct 2015, 02:47

Something to keep an eye on, the PMK site is up but there seem to be some issues on it. The legal PDF link they've got for those submitting an IC seems incorrect at the moment; they're linking to pimpmykeyboard-com.mybigcommerce.com but the link is actually http://pimpmykeyboard.com/product_image ... yments.pdf

Beyond that, it's a bit vague as to what gets promoted up to voting. I'm hoping they flesh that out a bit more as time goes on.

SL89 · 07 Oct 2015, 05:09

There's a lot of little issues, I was pricing something out and it just kept stacking one price despite the 2nd 3rd and 4th items being very different.

niomosy · 07 Oct 2015, 22:54

Yeah, the site definitely still needs some work. Looks like they're making updates as I already see some changes in the keysets listings.

zslane · 07 Oct 2015, 23:20

One peculiar byproduct of posting an interest check on PMK now is that if it reaches their "go" threshold, the project automatically goes into production. Given how (procedurally) automated that is, I would say that posting an IC there definitely binds you to selling through them unless you make some sort of special arrangement to the contrary.

SL89 · 07 Oct 2015, 23:23

That's news to me then.

zslane · 07 Oct 2015, 23:36

Apparently this is how SP is pitching the new process:

RIP Group Buys, hello more products!
As many of you know, the Interest Check and Group Buy process made for some lengthy wait times. So now, we’re cutting back your wait time and going straight from Interest Checks into production. Now you'll get the keysets you want, in far less time.

SL89 · 07 Oct 2015, 23:37

Yeah, no, let's avoid that.

zslane · 07 Oct 2015, 23:47

The advantage to going through PMK is that they handle everything for you after you send them your promotional image(s). The disadvantage is that you have no control over the interest check/voting process, nor over how many sets will be made available to the public for purchase.

SL89 · 07 Oct 2015, 23:55

Their version of an interest check is different then the signal boost and discussion we would do before hand. If we organize well on the forums and Reddit a successful pmk ic would be fine.

zslane · 08 Oct 2015, 00:22

Just so I understand, "organizing on the forums and reddit" basically means firing up three or more simultaneous threads of discussion on the same thing (this thread here on DT being the first). That means repeating ourselves three or more times on every issue (kit composition in particular). And then, once the din has died down thrice (or more), we direct everyone to PMK or MassDrop or whatever to drive the "group buy" itself. Is that how this works?

niomosy · 08 Oct 2015, 00:46

zslane wrote: ↑Just so I understand, "organizing on the forums and reddit" basically means firing up three or more simultaneous threads of discussion on the same thing (this thread here on DT being the first). That means repeating ourselves three or more times on every issue (kit composition in particular). And then, once the din has died down thrice (or more), we direct everyone to PMK or MassDrop or whatever to drive the "group buy" itself. Is that how this works?

It's multiple threads, yes, but not quite to the level you're thinking. What I've seen is that you create multiple IC threads for the generation of interest and direct them to your forum of choice for the primary thread. For example, there exists a Round 5 thread on GeekHack but the primary discussion is on Deskthority. Similarly, I've seen people post here but carry out the main discussions on GeekHack. Reddit, give the format of its forum, isn't the greatest place to hold the primary thread so it's more an interest generator with some initial discussion. It can be helpful for filtering things out by popularity as the more popular comments and questions tend to get upvoted.

On GH, you'd also typically lock the IC thread and create a group buy thread in the group buy forum once the IC had moved to that phase.

zslane · 08 Oct 2015, 02:43

Posting a "go to DT for the real discussion" message on geekhack and reddit makes sense to me as a way of centralizing discussion, but it does then limit (deeper) participation to only those who have accounts here, yes?

I don't have any objection to that in principle, but I am curious if that hinders broader community participation in the IC. What is the overlap in membership like? I don't have a good sense of that.

Muirium · 08 Oct 2015, 02:57

GH is much larger than DT. In user base as well as the complexity of how they run the joint. There is overlap, for sure, but we're generally the smaller, more talkative crowd. I've often heard GH folk say they like how civil the conversation is at DT. What you get at GH (and I suppose Reddit too, though I honestly don't even know how to navigate that place) is much more shouty and random comments on threads, by more people at a hotter pace.

Typically, the most interested people will go to wherever the conversation is at. Details freaks have a natural home here, while whoopers and meme feeders don't so much. Which means, yes, I think you've got the right idea. But then I would, as a lazy DT exclusive user! It'd make a change from all the crossposts we get here from finished ICs at GH.

niomosy · 08 Oct 2015, 03:15

It wouldn't quite end up a "go to DT" but the main discussions would end up being here. That said, the other sites would likely get their fare share of discussion as well. Honestly, DT is well enough known that it wouldn't be a tremendous issue to host the parent thread here and have the other forums handle child threads if you chose to go that route. It's not as if it would be the first time that was done. Plus there's always plenty of uses of both that could share the information from DT, keeping the remote threads going.

zslane · 08 Oct 2015, 03:39

I just want to avoid answering the same questions, addressing the same issues and concerns, explaining the kit compositions, etc., in multiple places. I'm sure there are GB organizers out there with the patience for that, but I am not one of them (another reason I am not cut out to be a GB organizer).

I have no problem with posting a comprehensive description of the set, with renders and specifications galore, and then inviting interested individuals to come here and participate in this thread if so inclined. I am not likely to spend very much time following up in any of those other places after that; maybe someone with a more active presence in those spaces can fill that role?

niomosy · 08 Oct 2015, 06:14

Honestly, it shouldn't likely be a problem. There are enough of us that visit all the sites that the information should flow pretty easily. I can certainly pitch in as I'm able to on GH and Reddit.

SL89 · 08 Oct 2015, 18:29

niomosy wrote: ↑Honestly, it shouldn't likely be a problem. There are enough of us that visit all the sites that the information should flow pretty easily. I can certainly pitch in as I'm able to on GH and Reddit.

I agree with this so much.

Let's make the DT thread here the primary thread, with redirects on reddit and GH going this way. Let the main discussion of composition / options happen here. And let the reddit posts and GH threads just be for updates and redirects.

Usually people host the main convo on GH due to its traffic with secondary threads here and on reddit (IvanIvanovich is a good example of this case. )

niomosy · 08 Oct 2015, 21:01

Consider the rest of us Home Depot. You can do it. We can help

sero · 11 Oct 2015, 11:41

Glad to see the 3D mockups got made. With mockups like that people will surely buy into this. You may know all this already, but here is my take on how to generate the most interest you can on reddit if you ever want to do that:

First, you'll want to post both of those mockups to an imgur album and link that album to your reddit post. No need to post a bunch of pictures, just the two would be optimal. Secondly, you'll want to post in the morning before noon EST. I wouldn't recommend doing it on a Saturday or Sunday. Within the first hour of making the post, have everyone you know upvote it to get it to the front page where others can do the same. Lastly, be sure to comment on the post after you make it with all the relevant info and a link back here to DT if needed. Using this method you should get the most views and upvotes possible on there. This is important because reddit users are bad about actually buying things, and the more upvotes you get, the longer your post stays on the front page for exposure. Once it falls off the front page, the post basically dies so use your chances to market this there wisely. You can make one post for the IC and one post when the GB starts.

zslane · 11 Oct 2015, 18:26

Thanks for the guidance, sero!

zslane · 12 Oct 2015, 05:52

Here are a couple of new renders. I thought it might be fun to see the keycaps as if installed in a Cherry G80-3000 style keyboard.

: SA Dasher keycaps in a Cherry G80-3000 style board; dasher_keyboard_cherry_01.jpg (242.4 KiB) Viewed 6958 times

One sorta fun thing about that keyboard is that there is ample top surface area to give it an indigo paint job, harkening back to the original Dasher boards of old.

: SA Dasher keycaps in a Cherry G80-3000 style board with indigo paint job; dasher_keyboard_cherry_02.jpg (238.13 KiB) Viewed 6958 times

niomosy · 12 Oct 2015, 06:55

Damn. That set's making wish the GH-122 project would start up again. This would be an awesome set on an ANSI layout 122 board

With Reddit, when you do post there, let us know in here as well so we can help out on the upvotes.