Missing spring of a beam spring !
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
Hello,
The displaywriter that I started to restore is missing a spring.
Does anyone know where can I source it ?
Also the control keycap is broken underneath, but I guess that I will be able to kind of fix it with epoxy.
Thanks in advance
The displaywriter that I started to restore is missing a spring.
Does anyone know where can I source it ?
Also the control keycap is broken underneath, but I guess that I will be able to kind of fix it with epoxy.
Thanks in advance
- scottc
- ☃
- Location: Remote locations in Europe
- Main keyboard: GH60-HASRO 62g Nixies, HHKB Pro1 HS, Novatouch
- Main mouse: Steelseries Rival 300
- Favorite switch: Nixdorf 'Soft Touch' MX Black
- DT Pro Member: -
I have several spare J/4 tripleshot keys. They're not ideal, but I can send you one for the cost of shipping if you want an easy replacement.
- XMIT
- [ XMIT ]
- Location: Austin, TX area
- Main keyboard: XMIT Hall Effect
- Main mouse: CST L-Trac Trackball
- Favorite switch: XMIT 60g Tactile Hall Effect
- DT Pro Member: 0093
This is the Lock key that is (correctly) missing a spring. The beam spring mechanism pulls the key down (or rather, pulls the sensor foot to remove force from the key press, designed to emulate a Selectric typewriter moving the interposer bar out of the way on a key press). The Lock key stays down. A foot and a linkage connected by a linkage bar to the two Shift keys is responsible for popping it back up.
So, it's not missing per se, it was never there to begin with. But I agree that it would be nice if that key had a spring.
If you do add one - you will need to remove the linkage mechanism as well.
I'm considering stealing the switch immediately to the right of Backspace on my setup. One less key, but then I get my Lock key back as a usable key.
So, it's not missing per se, it was never there to begin with. But I agree that it would be nice if that key had a spring.
If you do add one - you will need to remove the linkage mechanism as well.
I'm considering stealing the switch immediately to the right of Backspace on my setup. One less key, but then I get my Lock key back as a usable key.
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
Yes, it is the lock key.XMIT wrote: ↑This is the Lock key that is (correctly) missing a spring. The beam spring mechanism pulls the key down (or rather, pulls the sensor foot to remove force from the key press, designed to emulate a Selectric typewriter moving the interposer bar out of the way on a key press). The Lock key stays down. A foot and a linkage connected by a linkage bar to the two Shift keys is responsible for popping it back up.
Let me check this bar... I did not know what is was for. Actually a plastic piece felt. It could be that something broke.
- scottc
- ☃
- Location: Remote locations in Europe
- Main keyboard: GH60-HASRO 62g Nixies, HHKB Pro1 HS, Novatouch
- Main mouse: Steelseries Rival 300
- Favorite switch: Nixdorf 'Soft Touch' MX Black
- DT Pro Member: -
Sorry idollar - I'm not sure if you misunderstood me but I was offering a keycap to replace your broken control key. Unfortunately I don't have any spare key modules or parts as mine suffers from a few broken keys itself.
Interesting! How did you learn this?XMIT wrote: ↑This is the Lock key that is (correctly) missing a spring. The beam spring mechanism pulls the key down (or rather, pulls the sensor foot to remove force from the key press, designed to emulate a Selectric typewriter moving the interposer bar out of the way on a key press). The Lock key stays down. A foot and a linkage connected by a linkage bar to the two Shift keys is responsible for popping it back up.
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
I send some pictures on how to dismantle the bloody bar.
I ended up taking apart the board, including the PCB.
There is a plastic piece underneath that uses the same type of clips that the switches have. There is a kind of an arrow inserted on them. One can push them up:
In the following picture I show you how to push up with the screw driver.
I ended up taking apart the board, including the PCB.
There is a plastic piece underneath that uses the same type of clips that the switches have. There is a kind of an arrow inserted on them. One can push them up:
In the following picture I show you how to push up with the screw driver.
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
I understand now. Thanks for the offer anyhow. I will try to fix the keycap, this is my secondary problem now.scottc wrote: ↑Sorry idollar - I'm not sure if you misunderstood me but I was offering a keycap to replace your broken control key. Unfortunately I don't have any spare key modules or parts as mine suffers from a few broken keys itself.
Interesting! How did you learn this?
The main issue is the broken plastic part and/or the spring.
Thanks a lot
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
And we all know that this is not an entry of the "lots of pictures" series, but the camera was on the tripod.
As veryone knows that the best way to avoid loosing parts of a keyboard is to store it mounted. In the process of mounting it back, I took some pictures. Note that I left the controller dismantlement.
The foam felt apart when I took the bottom. It was very fragile and would stick to everything:
As veryone knows that the best way to avoid loosing parts of a keyboard is to store it mounted. In the process of mounting it back, I took some pictures. Note that I left the controller dismantlement.
The foam felt apart when I took the bottom. It was very fragile and would stick to everything:
- XMIT
- [ XMIT ]
- Location: Austin, TX area
- Main keyboard: XMIT Hall Effect
- Main mouse: CST L-Trac Trackball
- Favorite switch: XMIT 60g Tactile Hall Effect
- DT Pro Member: 0093
Yeah, it's okay that the foam is so degraded. I would be sure to remove as much of it as you can, and to give all of the individual switches a (gentle!) bath in isopropyl alcohol. Otherwise, between the contamination shield pieces and the foam, you'll end up getting little bits on the PCB that will interfere with sensing and render the keyboard useless until you clean it again. (Ask me how I know.) You can maybe replace that foam with the same sort of foam you might use for a Model F - it serves the same purpose - but you will need to draw your own template.
The screws that secure the PCB to the rest of the case - make sure to tighten them lightly and evenly, otherwise the PCB can bow interfering with capacitive sensing.
I still think your best bet is moving the switch for the key just to the right of Backspace (Index IIRC) and using that for Lock. I find that this funny half-width key interferes with my ability to find Backspace correctly.
Over on GH I posted a key mapping that I find works quite well for these keyboards. When I'm in front of a real computer maybe I'll post that here as well. I was eventually going to post my own workshop thread on the (slow) restoration of my own Displaywriter board.
Oh weird - mine didn't have a palm rest! I would try Krazy Glue (cyanoacrylate) to get the pieces back together.
Did you end up getting one of the boards from phosphorglow? If so - make sure to line it up carefully on the edge connector, so that the contacts are centered. Try to get a photo of this - phosphorglow asked me for one and I never got around to it!
The screws that secure the PCB to the rest of the case - make sure to tighten them lightly and evenly, otherwise the PCB can bow interfering with capacitive sensing.
I still think your best bet is moving the switch for the key just to the right of Backspace (Index IIRC) and using that for Lock. I find that this funny half-width key interferes with my ability to find Backspace correctly.
Over on GH I posted a key mapping that I find works quite well for these keyboards. When I'm in front of a real computer maybe I'll post that here as well. I was eventually going to post my own workshop thread on the (slow) restoration of my own Displaywriter board.
Oh weird - mine didn't have a palm rest! I would try Krazy Glue (cyanoacrylate) to get the pieces back together.
Did you end up getting one of the boards from phosphorglow? If so - make sure to line it up carefully on the edge connector, so that the contacts are centered. Try to get a photo of this - phosphorglow asked me for one and I never got around to it!
- XMIT
- [ XMIT ]
- Location: Austin, TX area
- Main keyboard: XMIT Hall Effect
- Main mouse: CST L-Trac Trackball
- Favorite switch: XMIT 60g Tactile Hall Effect
- DT Pro Member: 0093
Oh - if you're going to put a real switch in for the Lock key you don't need the linkage assembly at all. When I take mine apart, I'll remove my linkage bar entirely.
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
Thanks !
(I will check my email again, it could be also that I missed his email). I also sent him a PM, with the same result.
That was my plan.XMIT wrote: ↑Yeah, it's okay that the foam is so degraded. I would be sure to remove as much of it as you can, and to give all of the individual switches a (gentle!) bath in isopropyl alcohol. Otherwise, between the contamination shield pieces and the foam, you'll end up getting little bits on the PCB that will interfere with sensing and render the keyboard useless until you clean it again. (Ask me how I know.) You can maybe replace that foam with the same sort of foam you might use for a Model F - it serves the same purpose - but you will need to draw your own template.
The screws that secure the PCB to the rest of the case - make sure to tighten them lightly and evenly, otherwise the PCB can bow interfering with capacitive sensing.
Thanks for the advice. I need to think about it.I still think your best bet is moving the switch for the key just to the right of Backspace (Index IIRC) and using that for Lock. I find that this funny half-width key interferes with my ability to find Backspace correctly.
Do it. We can make a "lot of pictures" together. This would be fun.Over on GH I posted a key mapping that I find works quite well for these keyboards. When I'm in front of a real computer maybe I'll post that here as well. I was eventually going to post my own workshop thread on the (slow) restoration of my own Displaywriter board.
I will look for the glue. Thanks.Oh weird - mine didn't have a palm rest! I would try Krazy Glue (cyanoacrylate) to get the pieces back together.
I did. I ordered from his site. I had no answer, no feedback. Only an automated email stating that the order was received.Did you end up getting one of the boards from phosphorglow? If so - make sure to line it up carefully on the edge connector, so that the contacts are centered. Try to get a photo of this - phosphorglow asked me for one and I never got around to it!
(I will check my email again, it could be also that I missed his email). I also sent him a PM, with the same result.
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
I need to make my mind. I guess that the best would be to take the bar to have something closer to a "regular" keyboard.XMIT wrote: ↑Oh - if you're going to put a real switch in for the Lock key you don't need the linkage assembly at all. When I take mine apart, I'll remove my linkage bar entirely.
On the other hand, I would like to restore it as close as possible to the original. I actually have the complete displaywriter, including the printer. It would be fun to bring it alive again.
I will try to glue the parts together anyhow. In any case it is a good experiment.
This is the glue that you recommend me, is't it ?
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Krazy-Glue-Sekun ... 338ccf8132
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
I forgot to mention that it was shreebles the one that actually noticed the broken part. It felt during our "IBM CAMP". (I picked up the displaywriter on this same trip).
Without him, there would be no choice to make.
Thanks shreebles ! A demonstration on how useful is to do things with others.
Without him, there would be no choice to make.
Thanks shreebles ! A demonstration on how useful is to do things with others.
Last edited by idollar on 30 Aug 2015, 21:32, edited 1 time in total.
- XMIT
- [ XMIT ]
- Location: Austin, TX area
- Main keyboard: XMIT Hall Effect
- Main mouse: CST L-Trac Trackball
- Favorite switch: XMIT 60g Tactile Hall Effect
- DT Pro Member: 0093
Yep, that's the glue I mentioned. Clean thoroughly using isopropyl alcohol, use a tiny amount of glue, hold in place for 30 seconds... and be gentle on the part in the future. It is better than nothing but only just.
I use 3M DP460 epoxy for when I really need things to stick together well. This is what I use for restoring cracked Model M barrel plates. But it is expensive in three ways: the epoxy itself is expensive, the special applicator gun is expensive, and the mixing nozzles (a consumable) are not cheap and also use a fair amount of epoxy themselves. I try to batch my epoxy work together to minimize waste.
I use 3M DP460 epoxy for when I really need things to stick together well. This is what I use for restoring cracked Model M barrel plates. But it is expensive in three ways: the epoxy itself is expensive, the special applicator gun is expensive, and the mixing nozzles (a consumable) are not cheap and also use a fair amount of epoxy themselves. I try to batch my epoxy work together to minimize waste.
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
Already ordered.XMIT wrote: ↑Yep, that's the glue I mentioned. Clean thoroughly using isopropyl alcohol, use a tiny amount of glue, hold in place for 30 seconds... and be gentle on the part in the future. It is better than nothing but only just.
From what you say it should be really good. I will have to check it.I use 3M DP460 epoxy for when I really need things to stick together well. This is what I use for restoring cracked Model M barrel plates. But it is expensive in three ways: the epoxy itself is expensive, the special applicator gun is expensive, and the mixing nozzles (a consumable) are not cheap and also use a fair amount of epoxy themselves. I try to batch my epoxy work together to minimize waste.
Why don't we create a post in the workshop with the tools that we use ? It will be good to have a single place with all the references.
- XMIT
- [ XMIT ]
- Location: Austin, TX area
- Main keyboard: XMIT Hall Effect
- Main mouse: CST L-Trac Trackball
- Favorite switch: XMIT 60g Tactile Hall Effect
- DT Pro Member: 0093
Ordered? Okay. Around here it is easy enough to find any similar "super glue" at any grocery store or pharmacy for a couple of dollars.
If your goal is restoration then sure borrowing/stealing a switch may not be ideal. Mine is to use it over USB with an xwhatsit board so this is a better option for me.
If your goal is restoration then sure borrowing/stealing a switch may not be ideal. Mine is to use it over USB with an xwhatsit board so this is a better option for me.
- idollar
- i$
- Location: Germany (Frankfurt area)
- Main keyboard: IBM F or M
- Favorite switch: BS
- DT Pro Member: -
We an also find "super glue" around in Germany. It will be here for the next session....XMIT wrote: ↑Ordered? Okay. Around here it is easy enough to find any similar "super glue" at any grocery store or pharmacy for a couple of dollars.
I have not made my mind still. I do not have time to restore the rest of the displaywriter. I do not have the software neither.If your goal is restoration then sure borrowing/stealing a switch may not be ideal. Mine is to use it over USB with an xwhatsit board so this is a better option for me.
I need to thing about it. I am currently inclined to the USB option.
- shreebles
- Finally 60%
- Location: Cologne, Germany
- Main keyboard: FaceW 45g Silent Red /NerD60 MX Red
- Main mouse: Logitech G303 / GPro (home) MX Anywhere 2 (work)
- Favorite switch: Silent Red, Old Browns, Buckling Spring,
- DT Pro Member: 0094
You are very welcome, I'm surprised and happy to see that I was a positive influence on your displaywriter...idollar wrote: ↑I forgot to mention that it was shreebles the one that actually noticed the broken part.
See, that is the upside of my short attention span, I can notice things happening very fast