deskthority

It's annoying blue teddy bear kid again.

You have probably seen my posts on DT about my keyboard problems and sorry about that.

I finally have some money to spend on a GOOD keyboard (around $60, $70 TOPS), so I decided to look around.

I had the idea of replacing the Green alps in my Zenith and putting in Matias ones, and that may've been a good idea (still have the parts, case, plate and PCB), but people here don't seem to like those very much (and I'm not sure about spending so much on this - what if the whole thing doesn't work and I have to spend an entire day desoldering the switches?). Good thing though, I will be soon selling the switches to someone (sorry about the postage shenanigans, they will be resolved) for some extra pocket money.
Old Alps are out of the question unless I find a board at the flea market

Then I got notified of the sale that webwit is doing, and I was super pumped, but then I realized I probably won't be able to afford most of the stuff he had, but then..

..then I decided that I wanted to buy a Buckling spring keyboard assembly from someone here and a cool industrial case from webwit, and I had the Idea of getting one of those MF PCBs to replace the membrane (only 25 million lifetime man), but now I found out that they cost crazy money!

I thought I mostly knew everything I needed to! But I couldn't imagine that choosing a good keyboard (by DT standards) would be such a big and complicated decision for me.

I apologize for all the spam. I'm just trying to figure this out. I don't even know what's good for me. Just something clicky and good!

..any ideas to end the confusion? Thank you guys. You rock!

EDIT: The confusion has mostly gone away now! I will wait for a good deal to show up here.

you live in germany right ? you should search on ebay-kleinanzeigen.de for any Cherry keyboard where you can find "G80-XXXX XSXXX" this means that it would be Cherry blue switches, which aren't rare by any mean. I'll come back with some links if I have enough time to this evening.

Good luck with your pruchase if I can't help you !!

Myoth wrote: ↑you live in germany right ? you should search on ebay-kleinanzeigen.de for any Cherry keyboard where you can find "G80-XXXX XSXXX" this means that it would be Cherry blue switches, which aren't rare by any mean. I'll come back with some links if I have enough time to this evening.

Good luck with your pruchase if I can't help you !!

Nope, I don't live in Germany. I hopefully will one day and leave Hungary behind for higher education.

I know about that trick, but my fear is that I would not be happy with a Cherry keyboard like that in a couple of months and be back to square one. I haven't tried a cherry clicky switch yet, but you guys all say they are bad.

thank you

In my opinion get yourself a decent model M
25 million keypresses is literally a few years of non stop pressing the key 2 times/second.

Dingster wrote: ↑In my opinion get yourself a decent model M
25 million keypresses is literally a few years of non stop pressing the key 2 times/second.

But I want to use my keyboard for a very very long time! Just like with Alps, lifetime is not great, just a bit better.

I was actually shocked when I found it out!

Damn it, why is this choice so damn hard?

green-squid wrote: ↑

Myoth wrote: ↑you live in germany right ? you should search on ebay-kleinanzeigen.de for any Cherry keyboard where you can find "G80-XXXX XSXXX" this means that it would be Cherry blue switches, which aren't rare by any mean. I'll come back with some links if I have enough time to this evening.

Good luck with your pruchase if I can't help you !!

Nope, I don't live in Germany. I hopefully will one day and leave Hungary behind for higher education.

I know about that trick, but my fear is that I would not be happy with a Cherry keyboard like that in a couple of months and be back to square one. I haven't tried a cherry clicky switch yet, but you guys all say they are bad.

thank you

They definitly aren't the greatest but if you're craving a mech so much they would be enough, plus you haven't tried anything else, so they would be good entry switches.

eh hungary should be close enough to germany to be able to purchase things from here (mind you I already bought things from here even though I'm french !)

Dingster wrote: ↑In my opinion get yourself a decent model M
25 million keypresses is literally a few years of non stop pressing the key 2 times/second.

I agree with this. Also you mentioned you care about other people's opinions on switches; it's irrelevant if you like the keyboard. I'm sure I'd still be completely satisfied with my SSK if I never tried a Model F. And just because it's rated for 25 million actuations doesn't mean it'll die the moment it exceeds that. You'd have a hard time killing a Model M.

green-squid wrote: ↑

Dingster wrote: ↑In my opinion get yourself a decent model M
25 million keypresses is literally a few years of non stop pressing the key 2 times/second.

But I want to use my keyboard for a very very long time! Just like with Alps, lifetime is not great, just a bit better.

I was actually shocked when I found it out!

Damn it, why is this choice so damn hard?

if you get a Model M it would last for a VERY long time, don't even stress about it, if so many are still alive after 30 years, it's for a reason.

green-squid wrote: ↑Nope, I don't live in Germany. I hopefully will one day and leave Hungary behind for higher education.

Lengyel, magyar – két jó barát,
Együtt harcol s issza borát,
Vitéz s bátor mindkettője,
Áldás szálljon mindkettőre.


Now with that out of the way. You're stressing to much over this. There's no going to be "one buy" since you're already hooked Choosing a keeb is a very personal matter. Sure one can ask for advice or info, but there's no definitive answer, until you find it yourself.

Surely there're some auction sites in Hungary. You got the general idea of what's worth a buy and what not so much.
Buy and try locally, then sell. Keep the cricle going until you know what characteristics you like in switches.
Then do the proper hunting

This is from personal experience. I've jumped into this hobby not long ago myself, and if the only option was to buy stuff from DT or Ebay it would be long over. The prices are insane for poor easterner like me. Never payed more than 50€ for a keyboard, and that's my limit. Things may look dry at the moment but if you're patient something interesting will show up eventually. To give you an example. I was convinced that getting blue alps board is impossible in here. Yet 2 months of checking local auction site an viola one Datacomp and one Acer showed up with blues. Both selled for about 45€.

So be cool and patient, and enjoy the ride.

FXT wrote: ↑

Dingster wrote: ↑In my opinion get yourself a decent model M
25 million keypresses is literally a few years of non stop pressing the key 2 times/second.

I agree with this. Also you mentioned you care about other people's opinions on switches; it's irrelevant if you like the keyboard. I'm sure I'd still be completely satisfied with my SSK if I never tried a Model F. And just because it's rated for 25 million actuations doesn't mean it'll die the moment it exceeds that. You'd have a hard time killing a Model M.

I cite others' opinions because I don't want to hop between keyboards to find the best one for me. I see some people do that on Reddit (with disposable income). I know beamspring would be the best one for me, but come on, you will never get that in your lifetime.

As for lifetime, I want to feel safe that my keyboard will last a long time. 25 million sounds like Alps levels of low. And the keyboard unit from Wodan is probably halfway through its life. Maybe I coul get a new membrane, but at this point membrane is a dirty word.

but you are probably right.

green-squid wrote: ↑

FXT wrote: ↑

Dingster wrote: ↑In my opinion get yourself a decent model M
25 million keypresses is literally a few years of non stop pressing the key 2 times/second.

I agree with this. Also you mentioned you care about other people's opinions on switches; it's irrelevant if you like the keyboard. I'm sure I'd still be completely satisfied with my SSK if I never tried a Model F. And just because it's rated for 25 million actuations doesn't mean it'll die the moment it exceeds that. You'd have a hard time killing a Model M.

I cite others' opinions because I don't want to hop between keyboards to find the best one for me. I see some people do that on Reddit (with disposable income). I know beamspring would be the best one for me, but come on, you will never get that in your lifetime.

As for lifetime, I want to feel safe that my keyboard will last a long time. 25 million sounds like Alps levels of low. And the keyboard unit from Wodan is probably halfway through its life. Maybe I coul get a new membrane, but at this point membrane is a dirty word.

but you are probably right.

You are overthinking this way too much man... Dont't you wonder why model Ms are still alive today

I own/have owned the following keyboards: 2 full-size Model Ms, SSK, F AT, F XT, F107, Pingmaster, and a 6580 DisplayWriter. Having said that, the beamsprings in the DisplayWriter are good, but they're definitely overrated. Capacitive buckling springs are just as good IMO, and the difference between the switches in an F and an M isn't as big as you'd think. I promise you won't be unhappy with a Model M, they're an amazing keyboard for the money. I also used a full-size M as my only keyboard for almost 5 years and I do a LOT of typing. When I was done with it I gave it to a close friend who is still using it. It still feels exactly the same as when I first bought it. You likely won't kill an M by just typing.

purdobol wrote: ↑

green-squid wrote: ↑Nope, I don't live in Germany. I hopefully will one day and leave Hungary behind for higher education.

Lengyel, magyar – két jó barát,
Együtt harcol s issza borát,
Vitéz s bátor mindkettője,
Áldás szálljon mindkettőre.


Now with that out of the way. You're stressing to much over this. There's no going to be "one buy" since you're already hooked Choosing a keeb is a very personal matter. Sure one can ask for advice or info, but there's no definitive answer, until you find it yourself.

Surely there're some auction sites in Hungary. You got the general idea of what's worth a buy and what not so much.
Buy and try locally, then sell. Keep the cricle going until you know what characteristics you like in switches.
Then do the proper hunting



This is from personal experience. I've jumped into this hobby not long ago myself, and if the only option was to buy stuff from DT or Ebay it would be long over. The prices are insane for poor easterner like me. Never payed more than 50€ for a keyboard, and that's my limit. Things may look dry at the moment but if you're patient something interesting will show up eventually. To give you an example. I was convinced that getting blue alps board is impossible in here. Yet 2 months of checking local auction site an viola one Datacomp and one Acer showed up with blues. Both selled for about 45€.

So be cool and patient, and enjoy the ride.

Egyetértek!!

Thank you so much for the reply man! I really do appreciate them!

I'm looking for 'that one' kb because the flea market KBs (mechanicals) are few and far between. I'm patient and all that, but I doubt I will ever find an M or something.

I have mostly given up on auction sites because it's hard to come by sometging good. I did decide to pass up a linear zenith keyboard because the option of an M came up here on DT. But who knows.

I always keep an eye out on things, but I'm not overly optimistic.

I KNOW I like clicky switches though. I like tactility as well, but clickiness is more the focus RN. But sometimes clickyness comes with tactility too!

I have been looking at lighter BOX switxhes, but good luck building a board with those under $70 (and I already have cherry doubleshot keycaps). JP said he still preferes BS to BOX.

I hope I will figure this stuff out. I'm somewhat stressed about it.

There are far better things in life to be stressed over than keyboards. Calm down. What's wrong with your Zenith anyway?

FXT wrote: ↑I own/have owned the following keyboards: 2 full-size Model Ms, SSK, F AT, F XT, F107, Pingmaster, and a 6580 DisplayWriter. Having said that, the beamsprings in the DisplayWriter are good, but they're definitely overrated. Capacitive buckling springs are just as good IMO, and the difference between the switches in an F and an M isn't as big as you'd think. I promise you won't be unhappy with a Model M, they're an amazing keyboard for the money. I also used a full-size M as my only keyboard for almost 5 years and I do a LOT of typing. When I was done with it I gave it to a close friend who is still using it. It still feels exactly the same as when I first bought it. You likely won't kill an M by just typing.

thank you friend!! I will try my luck with Wodan's M (if he ever responds).

I'm surprised you don't like beamsprings as much as some people here. I wonder if they would still cost as much as rent for months in an apartment if the preception was different.

But that lifetime has seriously been bothering me still. In 20 years it may not work, and I want it to work even then!

I hope they will figure that out. Or maybe I will figure it out (I will be 30 something by that time, hopefully no midlife crisis)

I never tried a beamspring, but id take an F122 or AT or XT over it any day. And I dont have a model F (wish I did every day). More usable layout, more IMPOSING and far far prettier, in my eyes at least

Only problem is getting one in Slovenia...............

Khers wrote: ↑There are far better things in life to be stressed over than keyboards. Calm down.

Okay, I may be overly cautious, but I just want to be SURE.

Khers wrote: ↑What's wrong with your Zenith anyway?

Nothing really, but like I said, what if it doesn't end up working and have to spend a day just to desolder the switches? And

Khers wrote: ↑What's wrong with you?

green-squid wrote: ↑

Khers wrote: ↑There are far better things in life to be stressed over than keyboards. Calm down.

Okay, I may be overly cautious, but I just want to be SURE.

Khers wrote: ↑What's wrong with your Zenith anyway?

Nothing really, but like I said, what if it doesn't end up working and have to spend a day just to desolder the switches? And

Khers wrote: ↑What's wrong with you?

Its gonna be quite a while till it comes to desoldering your Zenith And when it does consider it a positive experience. Like fixing your car or bike, and replacing parts. It served you well didnt it? No shame in some parts dying. They did what they had to. Its only normal...

Dingster wrote: ↑

green-squid wrote: ↑

Khers wrote: ↑There are far better things in life to be stressed over than keyboards. Calm down.

Okay, I may be overly cautious, but I just want to be SURE.

Khers wrote: ↑What's wrong with your Zenith anyway?

Nothing really, but like I said, what if it doesn't end up working and have to spend a day just to desolder the switches? And

Khers wrote: ↑What's wrong with you?

Its gonna be quite a while till it comes to desoldering your Zenith And when it does consider it a positive experience. Like fixing your car or bike, and replacing parts. It served you well didnt it? No shame in some parts dying. They did what they had to. Its only normal...

A simple component not working is not my fear. My fear is a static discharge that may kill it. And I can't even find matias switches for it for cheap.

No offense but you are overthinking this by a long shot. Dont be so paranoid and enjoy the boards

Nothing is made to last forever, not even a Model F. And that's fine, because I'm not destined for eternity either.

Iggy wrote: ↑Nothing is made to last forever, not even a Model F. And that's fine, because I'm not destined for eternity either.

Model Fs are the same as Golf mk2, the first thing that dies on it is the owner

Dingster wrote: ↑No offense but you are overthinking this by a long shot. Dont be so paranoid and enjoy the boards

I'm not sure if I can at this point..

Why did I make this so complicated

Iggy wrote: ↑Nothing is made to last forever, not even a Model F. And that's fine, because I'm not destined for eternity either.

Hopefully living longer (we are getting there with cancer, but Alzheimers sucks still..) will be resolved before I'm too old.

Aargh


Anyways, speaking of the M hopefully I will resolve my keyboard issues. Thank you

green-squid wrote: ↑ A simple component not working is not my fear. My fear is a static discharge that may kill it. And I can't even find matias switches for it for cheap.

chill dude... stuff is alot harder to break than you think. don't worry so much and your life will be so much easier

mike52787 wrote: ↑

green-squid wrote: ↑ A simple component not working is not my fear. My fear is a static discharge that may kill it. And I can't even find matias switches for it for cheap.

chill dude... stuff is alot harder to break than you think. don't worry so much and your life will be so much easier

It's hard not to worry about things like that for me

green-squid wrote: ↑

mike52787 wrote: ↑

green-squid wrote: ↑ A simple component not working is not my fear. My fear is a static discharge that may kill it. And I can't even find matias switches for it for cheap.

chill dude... stuff is alot harder to break than you think. don't worry so much and your life will be so much easier

It's hard not to worry about things like that for me

eventually you will stop caring about shit that doesnt matter, that is a part of growing up.

mike52787 wrote: ↑eventually you will stop caring about shit that doesnt matter, that is a part of growing up.

You are probably right, but I just want the best keyfeel without being disappointed

green-squid wrote: ↑ A simple component not working is not my fear. My fear is a static discharge that may kill it. And I can't even find matias switches for it for cheap.

Man get an M, mine was dropped in the floor facing under and with loot of sings from really heavy using. I can not so proudly say that I'm one of the few guys who broke a membrane buckling spring key by use. Intro and 0 from numpad have gone out of phase and the spacebar started to feel linear some time ago, still working. Even if you don't have new pivots is really easy to restore broken keys and without opening the keyboard. Don't worry about this sturdy monsters, even static or years on the yard can't kill them so easily.

A bolt-modded Model M will survive you.

(and even if something fails, there have been so many produced, that you'll always find spare parts)

So stop worrying and start your M hunt.

I once found one in bulk trash. It was (is... lol) dirty as hell, looked like shit, got probably wet several times and it still worked.