deskthority

Hello chaps,

Its been a while since I got a new board. While I have been very happy with my SSK and HHKB, I was on the look out for a new addition and the FC600C has been on my radar for sometime now.

I finally managed to pick one up just today, thanks @gaztec! I purchased his recently advertised board.

This post is therefore just my initial thoughts on the board, my gut feeling. To start, it is a thing of beauty, both in terms of construction and feel. The HHKB in my humble opinon does not come close in terms of construction and of course, being PCB mounted, the feel is very different. The feel on the FC660C is SOLID, there is no other way of describing it. I have in my collection a 87u also, and the FC660C feels more solid in terms of key press that that. I think the small form factor must have a part to play in creating this feeling. I will be conducting some side-by-side testing in due course.

I have an early model of the FC660C, it has the black laser engraved keycaps. On the whole, I am not that bothered, sure dyesubs would be nice, but then again it would have been nice to get my hands on the lighter casing and retro style caps, but that was not available for sale within my price point. The quality of the caps is excellent, I think. The lettering is average and I'll try and clean them up a little when the time comes. The texture and material feeling premium.

The key press of each switch is uniform, and it shows. There is real uniformity presence, the metal plate ensures this. The layout is very tradition, and this is something I have to get use to again, after being a long term HHKB user. I wrote my PhD on the HHKB so know it well. I am in the lucky position of being able to keep post this board and the HHKB, and will also be doing some side-by-side testing.

So far it is clear to say the following. This is an excellent keyboard, I mean this in terms of layout, build quality and usability. I only use a Mac and without changing the settings all that much, via the dip switches, I've got things to how I like them without fuss.

Availability of this excellent board as always been an issue in the UK and EU, but if you are on the market for a Topre keyswitch board in a compact form factor, the 65%, I think you'd be hard pushed to do better than the FC660C, in any variant. I'll take some insitu photographs shortly and upload.

Thanks for reading.

Hi, congratulations

I'd say the one advantage for me in favor of HHKB is Hasu's alternative controller, which makes the keyboard fully programmable with TMK firmware (thus, making it easy to have a consistent programming interface, similar to any other custom keyboard that uses TMK/QMK firmware etc.). Maybe Hasu could cook up something similar for the FC660C?

Your review also makes me think at ... a HHKB model enhanced with a plate Luckily, I also have a Novatouch, so that I have something to compare to - the feeling is great, but the one thing I don't like is exactly the fact that is not (easily) programmable (hope exists, here). Given the resources, I wouldn't say no to a Leopold, though

Nice review, even without the pics!

I've had a few 660C's. The first time I purged them was due to the fact there wasn't a DIP switch to allow for the CAPS/CTRL swap. The bottom case was also warped so it always rocked back and forth. My second and third 660C's also had the warped bottom case. It was an easy fix, but for the cost i felt like that shouldnt be such a constant issue.

I do think the white 660 is one of the best looking stock boards around. Sadly I just never got into the layout, I always end back on an HHKB.

livingspeedbump wrote: ↑I've had a few 660C's. The first time I purged them was due to the fact there wasn't a DIP switch to allow for the CAPS/CTRL swap. The bottom case was also warped so it always rocked back and forth. My second and third 660C's also had the warped bottom case. It was an easy fix, but for the cost i felt like that shouldnt be such a constant issue.

I do think the white 660 is one of the best looking stock boards around. Sadly I just never got into the layout, I always end back on an HHKB.

I'm quite shocked to read this, the serial number of my unit is 000463, of course I have no idea what this means but based on the fact its the black variant with laser keys, I'd say its early. It exhibits absolutely no issues and the build quality feels incredibly premium, and I say this in direct comparison to the HHKB which sits beside it. The former feels hollow in comparsion, this line is written with it and the rest of the post was written with the FC660c. I must admit I've not used the FC660c for any great lenght of time and of course the HHKB feels more comforrtable, as I'm familar with it, the cursor key layout is firmly etched into my mind.

Did you mention your quality control issues to Leopold? I agree the white FC660C is incredible beautiful!

Laser wrote: ↑Hi, congratulations

I'd say the one advantage for me in favor of HHKB is Hasu's alternative controller, which makes the keyboard fully programmable with TMK firmware (thus, making it easy to have a consistent programming interface, similar to any other custom keyboard that uses TMK/QMK firmware etc.). Maybe Hasu could cook up something similar for the FC660C?

Your review also makes me think at ... a HHKB model enhanced with a plate Luckily, I also have a Novatouch, so that I have something to compare to - the feeling is great, but the one thing I don't like is exactly the fact that is not (easily) programmable (hope exists, here). Given the resources, I wouldn't say no to a Leopold, though

Nice review, even without the pics!

My needs are very basic and as such Karabiner is able to resolve them all. I like keeping things stock but am of course aware of the Hasu controller. I only write documents in Word, write emails in Apple Mail and surf the internet. I am not a power user like many others on this forum. But as a touch typist and academic really do appretice having a proper keyboard to work with.

For me a set of retro SA profile keycaps would be sweet, but topre keycaps are few and far between.

ShivaYash wrote: ↑ For me a set of retro SA profile keycaps would be sweet, but topre keycaps are few and far between.

Luckily, Topre->MX sliders started to appear (1st on aliexpress, and in the near future - in BunnyLake's JTK groupbuy), so using SA profile keycaps made for the Cherry MX market (thick, and even PBT - another breakthrough) on Topre keyboards starts to become a reality

Laser wrote: ↑

ShivaYash wrote: ↑ For me a set of retro SA profile keycaps would be sweet, but topre keycaps are few and far between.

Luckily, Topre->MX sliders started to appear (1st on aliexpress, and in the near future - in BunnyLake's JTK groupbuy), so using SA profile keycaps made for the Cherry MX market (thick, and even PBT - another breakthrough) on Topre keyboards starts to become a reality

Without changing the feel or reliability? Being sliders, are they able to 'slide/ slip' off?

That's probably hard to tell at this time, but: those from aliexpress look similar to those already used in Plum/RoyalKludge Topre-clone keyboards - so you could look for reviews of how these keyboards feel (although you would have, in addition, original Topre domes); as for the JTK groupbuy, you can start reading (if you have the time etc.) here: https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=77 ... msg2307290

ShivaYash wrote: ↑

Laser wrote: ↑Hi, congratulations

I'd say the one advantage for me in favor of HHKB is Hasu's alternative controller, which makes the keyboard fully programmable with TMK firmware (thus, making it easy to have a consistent programming interface, similar to any other custom keyboard that uses TMK/QMK firmware etc.). Maybe Hasu could cook up something similar for the FC660C?

Your review also makes me think at ... a HHKB model enhanced with a plate Luckily, I also have a Novatouch, so that I have something to compare to - the feeling is great, but the one thing I don't like is exactly the fact that is not (easily) programmable (hope exists, here). Given the resources, I wouldn't say no to a Leopold, though

Nice review, even without the pics!

My needs are very basic and as such Karabiner is able to resolve them all. I like keeping things stock but am of course aware of the Hasu controller. I only write documents in Word, write emails in Apple Mail and surf the internet. I am not a power user like many others on this forum. But as a touch typist and academic really do appretice having a proper keyboard to work with.

For me a set of retro SA profile keycaps would be sweet, but topre keycaps are few and far between.

Karabiner is fine if you don't plant to travel around with a keyboard. But with a board this size I'd carry it with me to work and use it on my laptop and different work machines, so not having to rely on any software for my keyboard is pretty much a "must have" for me.

livingspeedbump wrote:

ShivaYash wrote: ↑

Laser wrote: ↑Hi, congratulations

I'd say the one advantage for me in favor of HHKB is Hasu's alternative controller, which makes the keyboard fully programmable with TMK firmware (thus, making it easy to have a consistent programming interface, similar to any other custom keyboard that uses TMK/QMK firmware etc.). Maybe Hasu could cook up something similar for the FC660C?

Your review also makes me think at ... a HHKB model enhanced with a plate Luckily, I also have a Novatouch, so that I have something to compare to - the feeling is great, but the one thing I don't like is exactly the fact that is not (easily) programmable (hope exists, here). Given the resources, I wouldn't say no to a Leopold, though

Nice review, even without the pics!

My needs are very basic and as such Karabiner is able to resolve them all. I like keeping things stock but am of course aware of the Hasu controller. I only write documents in Word, write emails in Apple Mail and surf the internet. I am not a power user like many others on this forum. But as a touch typist and academic really do appretice having a proper keyboard to work with.

For me a set of retro SA profile keycaps would be sweet, but topre keycaps are few and far between.

Karabiner is fine if you don't plant to travel around with a keyboard. But with a board this size I'd carry it with me to work and use it on my laptop and different work machines, so not having to rely on any software for my keyboard is pretty much a "must have" for me.

Indeed. I'm lucky, I only plug into my own machines so have the correctly configured Karabiner profile for each board.


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I can only confirm everything that ShivaYash is observing, I owned two HHKB's before getting my FC660C. I know what a following the HHKB has and how passionate HHKB owners are. For me the FC660C is the ultimate 60% keyboard, yeah I know it's really like 65% but that's just one aspect that makes it soo brilliant. One of the first things you'll notice about the FC660C is indeed the incredible build quality, it feels even more solid than a Realforce. The only negative aspect I can think of is the "bulky" case for such a small keyboard, it does not bother me but I could see how the bottom edge of the case may bother some. Concerning the availability unfortunately I cannot agree with ShivaYash, the FC660C is not officially sold in the EU, you have to either import ($$$), watch ebay or rather watch our marketplace. The price is steep but worth it IMO, provided you even like Topre switches.

Here is a crappy phone pic of my FC660C 45g / PBT spacebar and Hangul lasered PBT keycaps:
wiki/Leopold_FC_660C

We agree seebart, I said availability for us Europeans has always been in issue. Thanks for the photo. I want those keys!!


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ShivaYash wrote: ↑We agree seebart, I said availability for us Europeans has always been in issue. Thanks for the photo. I want those keys!!

OK I know what you mean, I guess we could PM / email NecromanX from mykeyboard.eu to take the FC660C up in their portfolio, he did mention that they will be offering Leopold keyboards.

vendors-f52/mykeyboard-eu-introduction-t15090.html

https://mykeyboard.eu

the FC660C is the keyboard I use the most. It is actually my daily driver at the office,
I have the beige DyeSub version, bought from Japan 6 months ago.
After I have added Hypersphere rings to it it became 10 times better. The feeling, the sound, the weight, the smell, the metal plate, the fact that I opened it 3 times and each time I struggled and it still looks unopened and the fact that it gives me a feeling of happiness and satisfaction each time I used it, make it the best modern keyboard I have in my collection.
Sometimes I think I am a bit of a masochist because I start typing on the laptop's keyboard just to have a higher feeling of release and satisfaction when I switch to the 660C
Also, I think it is the easiest keyboard I have to use when touch-typing (until now).
I do have 2 complains about it tough:
1. I want media controls on it, like the HHKB has. Why didn't Lepold place media controls on it, or on any of their keyboards? Why is it so hard? I got around this by installing a small program (not elegant, I know), Sound Volume Hotkeys, on my personal PC and on the work laptop.
2. I would have loved to have a LED under the 1.25u ctrl key too, like the Realforce, so it lights up when Ctrl and Caps are switched. Or the normal Caps Led should light up when Caps Lock is active, no matter the DIP switch configuration.
Hopefully Matt30 will get around to continue reverse engineering the controller board and we may get a controller for the FC660C too (not only the HHKB), which will solve the 2 issues I have above.
I would also love to find more keycaps for it (red, green, orange esc, enter, arrows and WASD), but thise are hard to find and when they show up... they are way too expensive

P.S.: I have never even seen a HHKB, so I might still be even more surprised by that one

Ok so one annoyance is that this lovely thing is not native for the Mac, which after using the HHKB for a long time feels strange. Does anyone have a recipe for Karabiner settings to get the FC660C to work and behave itself on OS X? I have tried to change the settings but its does not seem to working. It would be great if Leopold would be a Mac version (big ask!)

With thanks,

seebart wrote: ↑

ShivaYash wrote: ↑We agree seebart, I said availability for us Europeans has always been in issue. Thanks for the photo. I want those keys!!

OK I know what you mean, I guess we could PM / email NecromanX from mykeyboard.eu to take the FC660C up in their portfolio, he did mention that they will be offering Leopold keyboards.

vendors-f52/mykeyboard-eu-introduction-t15090.html

https://mykeyboard.eu

If have the FC660C on order and it will be in our stock soon. Hopefully within 14 days . Also stocking a couple FC980C boards. I will try to keep them available at all times. I might run out of them from time to time but I will restock them fast enough as Leopold has a stock in Korea so its only a matter of shipping.

A shame I'm using the HHKB again, until Karabiner works on macos Sierra.

Nice write-up ShivaYash.

Totally agree with you. One of my first mechanical keyboards besides the KUL ES87 with
mx-clears which was a total peace of shit for me. i bought the FC660M with mx-clears.

For that one i payed €118 + €39 for Leopold dy-sub printed keycaps “Qtang” really screwed me over..
Than i had to pay €48 customs crap Totalling €204 in well over $240 at that time.


But the mx-clears are a bit to heavy for me so i went looking for something new..
Talking with a few people on DK i quickly came to topre as being the smoothest switch out there..
i felt that 87U was to bulky and i did not like that the usb cable was non removable.

So the FC660C came on my radar..
This is what i had to pay for it. btw the tax thing was a lucky brake normally living
in freaking The Netherlands tax heaven for the 1% it means i have to pay 31% on top of everything
i order outside the F..ing EU.. so 21% tax and 11% customs fees..

For the keyboard €234,31 $246
For the o-rings mod and red escape key. $58,24 €55,33
Tax shit $30 €28
In total $317

So in total that’s €500 for two keyboards.. DAMMM that hurts..

i heavent used the o-rings yet so they are nicely packaged and one day i will mod my FC660C with these nice Topre o-rings.

i would gladly pay more to be able to replace the teensy on both keyboard turning them in to nice programable keyboards.
i’m no good in soldering so it would have to be a hotswap ..
Really wich someone could make that.. i believe there is a market for it..

Just wrote up 1upkeyboards pleading them to think about a nice FC660x Controller..who knows perhaps next year wil be the FC660x controller goodness year.. i'm hopeful

oeps forgot my pics..
this is me playing around with Dvorak Layout of corse the keycaps aren't made for this

Hmm...nice TuxKey, my favorite FC660C is still the grey on black.

Just got my FC660C from mykeyboards.eu and I have to admit that it feels a lot heavier than my old one. I bought my old one second hand back at the start of 2014, it has been modded and unmodded a number of times and has lost a lot of it's tactility. This new one feels heavier though and definitely more tactile.
I'm intrigued by how much the new one has changed in sound and tactility from my old one! Here's a quick shot of the two of them together:

Yes the ones we sell are the latest produced batch. Thanks for your purchase

I just assumed that my old one feels worn out, but was there some kind of change in the manufacturing that made them more tactile? This one feels almost like my 55g RF!

The first 2 batches had manufacturer faults where the tooling caused inconsistency on some domes especially on the top row. The PCBs and domes are made by Topre but the casing and final touches are done in another factory. I have a friend who bought a unit in the US end of last year and he got one of these early batch units as well and can confirm the inconsistency. I have no clue how this issue never got more attention.

TuxKey wrote: ↑oeps forgot my pics..
this is me playing around with Dvorak Layout of corse the keycaps aren't made for this

Dvorak_tuffLove.JPG

I use the Dvorak layout. I was wondering how you like this keyboard as Dvorak user. I can imagine that some of the special keys, like "home", "end" and "page-down" are not that easily accessible. Is this keyboard still recommended if you happen to like Dvorak?