Build quality of the KUL-ES Series compared to Filco?

[hKing]

Hello there,

as mentioned above.

I might buy a KUL with MX clear or MX black because the MX browns on my Filco are way to soft for me. I have strong fingers and tend to typo a lot.

Are those two boards comparable (especially build quality)?

When it comes to the price, there is no real difference. A Filco costs 155€ on Keayboardco, a KUL is 145€ on mechanicalkeyboards.nl

[imbattable]

Don't they come from the same manufacturer in China? Their design looks so much alike.

[Spikebolt]

Both have good quality, you can't go wrong with any. Filco does not come with MX Clear, though. Filco also does not have a detachable cable which can be a good or a bad thing depending on what you want.

If I was buying today, I'd get a Kul but that's just like my opinion.

[davkol]

FWIW KUL ES-87 has Cherry stabs AFAIK, whereas MJs come with Costar wire stabilizers. Another difference is in DIP switches (on KUL) or modifiability (Costar replacement controllers, aftermarket tenkeyless cases).

[Hypersphere]

I've owned a Filco MJ TKL Ninja with mx blue and two Kul ES87, one with mx brown and one with mx clear. I've sold the Filco and the Kuls. Now I have a CM QFS with mx brown and a WASD V2 87 with mx brown. I got the WASD as a "barebones" version (w/o caps), which is a great idea for saving money if you are going to put your own caps on it anyway.

Filco -- great build quality, Costar-type stabilizers (which I prefer for their feel). Didn't like the attached cable.

Kul -- solid, but some minor cosmetic flaws on the case. Good assortment of DIP switches. Didn't like the Cherry stabilizers.

CM QFS -- solid. Cannot swap Fn key with something else, such as Menu -- this is a limitation for me, because I like to remap to a HHKB-like layout and assign Menu or Rt Ctrl as Fn. I like the Costar-type stabilizers.

WASD -- solid, good assortment of DIP switches. Can assign my own Fn key. Costar-type stabilizers. Barebones option. Excellent customer service. This is my favorite of this bunch of Cherry mx TKL boards.

Overall, however, I prefer IBM Model F, Topre, and Matias Click or Matias Quiet switches to any Cherry mx switch.

Note: I've heard that Kul might be going out of business or perhaps it is just that some vendors are dropping their products. If you decide to go with Kul, you might want to look into what is happening with them.

[ocodo]

Please note that rumor about KUL is unfounded.

[Muirium]

How would you know?

Their stuff is certainly very expensive. And not particularly differentiated from the competition. That's generally a poor formula.

[Matt_]

Leopold's FC750R beats both of them anyway.

[davkol]

Please note that rumor about KUL is unfounded.

How so? It's half a year later, and both mechanicalkeyboards.com and mechanicalkeyboards.nl have essentially no stock of KUL ES-87. There is only EK left AFAIK. Do Keyed Up Labs have the same business model as Topre?

[scottc]

I wonder if ocodo works at KUL, perhaps.

[Khers]

Does sound rather plausible

[TuxKey]

mechanicalkeyboards.nl

Dear god did you say mechanicalkeyboards.nl !! and KUL

So i'm the first to support small businesses as both my parents are entrepreneurs
Last year around june i discovered a new company called KUL.
After reading there mission statements i was stoked finally a company that appeared to strive for excellence..
But there was no reseller in the EU..So i contacted KUL and asked if they were planning to sell these boards in the EU??
They said they were open to the idea and were looking in to it..
Wel as stoked as i was , i wasn't willing to wait so i started contacting resellers in the EU until i found a small reseller selling ducky and a couple for vortex boards.. you guessed it mechanicalkeyboard.nl ...
At first he didn't seem as stoked as i was..So i had to warm him up a bit..Well in the end he became a reseller..
And i even helped with the text on his site..in regards to the ES-87 being the only keyboard that works with a mac and linux..

Keyed Up Labs (aka KUL) bills itself as making the highest reliability Cherry MX keyboards on the market.
Disappointed with the high failure rates of available mechanical keyboards on the market,
that do not have the build quality to maximise the 50 million key-press potential of Cherry MX switches;
KUL set out to create a keyboard that could do these switches justice.
Bringing their first product to market in 2014, KUL intends to lead the market in high-quality keyboard design for professionals who depend on keyboard performance.

So is this Marketing speak, or is it actually of higher quality than other keyboards?

For the most part i think KUL succeeded where others failed, but i believe they have a long way to go before they crown themselves king of the hill.

As it happens to be I consider my self one of those “professionals who depend on keyboard performance” i’m a former carrier solder turned IT professional.
I have bin working in IT sinds the early 2000. I'm a Unix/Linux admin and apart from Linux i use a couple of OSX computers.

*** So lets start with the Positives ***

- One of the few keyboards with function keys that actually work.
And yes i also tested the function row on Linux (ubuntu/Fedora) it it works.

- Very nice dip-switch settings.
i have even heard someone cal it his TKL Happy Hacking Professional 2 if you can believe that

For those not familiar with dip-switchs , it’s basically a way to change the behaviour of your keyboard on a hardware level.
Meaning you set what you like and it works across all your computers and across different os types.

- i Love the large usb opening on the bottom that lets me use an angled short usb male/female cable so i can
easily swap my keyboard from one computer to the next..

- Very nice feet thicker form factor with rubber. (other brands could learn from this)

- I Like the dip-switch function sticker on the bottom.
So I don’t need to grab the manual every time.


- Good website where i can download paperwork if so needed..
Lots of other companies don’t have this.

- Good looking build, looks even better than a sum Filco boards and that’s saying a lot.
except for the caps-lock light that looks way better on the Filco..Especially if you use third party caps hiding the caps lock light coming from the keycap window..

*** And now the Negatives about the ES-87 and KUL as a company. (why the company because were buying a product and a promise of quality) ***

I’m a firm believer that any review that just talks about the warm fuzzy goodness of a product without mentioning
The possible negatives is just full of Sh.... or is just ignorant or even worst , has a hidden agenda, or is just clueless.

There is no such thing as perfect. Not in this price range. And even if you pay $300 or more, you would stil find someone stating something could be better..

- Also i believe that the way a person or company in particular handles problems or issues says as much about the company as the product does.

- i don’t like the ABS keycaps, even after a couple of weeks they start to shine and sum people complained about the printing starting to faid after a few weeks.

I do however understand the reasoning behind the usages of these keycaps (cutting down cost and so forth).
But my next negative makes this one even more important.

- I don’t like that customer support blames the usage of PBT keycaps instead of the stock ABS keycaps for the squeaky noise the backspace and enter keys makes.
Beside me not liking this. The company retweeted lots of tweets of people modding their keyboard with PBT and Third party ABS keycaps.

- I Prefer the caps-lock light that Filco uses on the top right side..
you won’t find this on many keyboards.

if you are going to mod your keyboard with sum nice expensive thick quality PBT keycaps.
Chances are those keycaps don’t have a caps-lock window..

- so has Keyed Up Labs (aka KUL) lived up to their promise of a higher quality keyboard??
And is this keyboard a game changer?

They made a couple of internal design choices that don’t separate them from the competition already on the market.
But the external choices and dip-switch settings makes this keyboard worth considering when shopping for a TKL board.

Looking back on the whole experience I had some rough dealings with customer support. (for which i have apologised)
When all was said and done, i did not receive the replacement I was promised. Also my dealings with Mechanicalkeyboards.nl went from good to bad. In the end i broke up any relation with this store and opted to just give away my KUL and stop dealing with this store..Later i learned i was not the only one Ducky has also chosen to break relations with him.
When you go to the Ducky site he is no longer listed as an officiel reseller..

btw the ducky website lists more stores in the EU including Netherlands.

Regardless of my bad experience with customer support, and mechanicalkeyboard.nl
i stand by my final conclusion of “it’s an ok keyboard”.
I decided to move away from mass production and got myself a topre board from Leopold..
And my next keyboard will be a community driven project something made by someone that loves what he or she is doing.
a real artisan like HaaTa or matt3o
Paying more doesn't bother me anymore..All good things in life cost more..

Thanks for reading my long rant..
I Payed $150 for my KUL ES-87.

Take care all..
That's just my two pennies' worth do with it what you may..

i consider it all a learning experience..so no loss

Also Please realise ENG is not my native language so if you have any questions please feel free to ask.

[Muirium]

Pretty much what I'd expect from some amateurs. Wouldn't be surprised at all if they wind up out of the keyboard business pretty quickly with attitude like that!

[Wilkie]

KUL might do well to sell the board in several enthusiast kits:

1) Case only (including the excellent feet and pads TuxKey mentioned)
2) No caps, no switches
3) No caps

The stock caps should really never be offered at the normal price.