Vintage Increases Value?

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Thorogrimm

29 Mar 2021, 02:06

As of late, and probably the last couple of years, there seems to be this influx of overly prices keyboards on eBay from people trying to make a grandiose profit from what would otherwise be keyboards that are actually worth peanuts. An example would be this Zenith membrane keyboard that someone is charging a ridiculous amount for, and I actually owned one of these before...
Image
They. Are. Terrible feeling. Amongst many other over-priced 'vintage' keyboards. These people must obviously realised there's a market for older keyboards but not actually know anything about the product. So is it literally the title of vintage that's bumping up the price so much? What is your take on this?

xxhellfirexx

29 Mar 2021, 02:54

I can't blame them for not knowing better. Unless you are into vintage keyboards and know how to identify switches, they are all about the same. It is also winkeyless so it must be old and old is good right?

As for pricing, they see Zenith keyboards selling for around $130 so they price theirs the same. Not many people will take the time looking up keyboard model numbers and identifying switches due to time and risk of breakage.

Then for SEO, they will call it "L@@K! Rare vintage Zenith black badge clicky mechanical keyboard" as that is the keywords most listings have.

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apb

29 Mar 2021, 03:20

xxhellfirexx wrote:
29 Mar 2021, 02:54
they will call it "L@@K! Rare vintage Zenith black badge clicky mechanical keyboard" as that is the keywords most listings have.
noticed this as well
clicky seems to be a favorite

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Thorogrimm

29 Mar 2021, 03:24

apb wrote:
29 Mar 2021, 03:20
xxhellfirexx wrote:
29 Mar 2021, 02:54
they will call it "L@@K! Rare vintage Zenith black badge clicky mechanical keyboard" as that is the keywords most listings have.
noticed this as well
clicky seems to be a favorite
𝙍𝘼𝙍𝙀 𝘾𝙇𝙄𝘾𝙆𝙔 𝙑𝙄𝙉𝙏𝘼𝙂𝙀 𝙈𝙀𝘾𝙃𝘼𝙉𝙄𝘾𝘼𝙇 𝙍𝙀𝙏𝙍𝙊 90𝙨 𝙆𝙀𝙔𝘽𝙊𝘼𝙍𝘿

motoko

29 Mar 2021, 03:51

RARE Chicony vintage keyboard clickety clack, Buy It Now $179 shipping $40

Rayndalf

29 Mar 2021, 04:16

Recently (couple hours ago) bought an F AT for $240 shipped and I considered that a deal. It's even missing the spacebar.

Guess I'll have to find some M caps and ANSI mod it :cry:


But yeah... I'm seeing people trying to sell F XTs for more than that, Ebay is a dumpster right now.

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ingmar

29 Mar 2021, 07:58

There are delusional sellers everywhere, always have been. It's certainly not limited to our niche: https://www.reddit.com/r/delusionalcraigslist/

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Go-Kart

29 Mar 2021, 12:01

I'd lean toward ignorance of sellers. They see a ZKB-2 sell for £120 and they just see 'Vintage Zenith Keyboard = £120', not knowing why their rubber dome board is unlikely to sell for a tenth of that.

the_ambyguous

29 Mar 2021, 14:33

the game is changing, for the worse. you used to be able to find a diamond in the rough. now everyone thinks all their garbage is gold. what a shame.

Findecanor

29 Mar 2021, 14:51

This is nothing really new, and always aggravating.
Some sellers also have a "fishing" tactic: start with an initial high price, and lower it only a little every week, hoping that someone who does not know better would bite.

micmil

29 Mar 2021, 18:22

It's just keyword spam.

What sucks is I see this going the way of guitars. A bunch of jackwagons looking to sell old crap started labeling everything old as "vintage" and a bunch of absolute schmucks that know nothing about instruments just eat it up. It's somehow been getting WORSE over the years to the point where absolute dumpster fire instruments (Norlin Gibsons, CBS Fenders) are commanding high prices solely because of age and not through any actual positive aspect.

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Palatino

29 Mar 2021, 18:28

On the flip side of sellers not knowing what they have, occasionally you can pick up something good for very little because they've basically advertised it as "Keyboard" with a single blurry photo, but enough for you to work out or have a good guess at what it is.

xxhellfirexx

29 Mar 2021, 19:54

Rayndalf wrote:
29 Mar 2021, 04:16
Recently (couple hours ago) bought an F AT for $240 shipped and I considered that a deal. It's even missing the spacebar.
That's not a good deal. You can get a model F AT for around $170 - $190 USD. Without the spacebar it would be around $140.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/IBM-Personal-C ... 3836683007
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-IBM-Mo ... 4578194578

Rayndalf

29 Mar 2021, 22:06

xxhellfirexx wrote:
29 Mar 2021, 19:54
Rayndalf wrote:
29 Mar 2021, 04:16
Recently (couple hours ago) bought an F AT for $240 shipped and I considered that a deal. It's even missing the spacebar.
That's not a good deal. You can get a model F AT for around $170 - $190 USD. Without the spacebar it would be around $140.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/IBM-Personal-C ... 3836683007
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-IBM-Mo ... 4578194578
That second one was the one I bought. Shipping was $80, so it was $240 with taxes and fees.

That first one was a pretty good deal.

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hellothere

30 Mar 2021, 00:40

Palatino wrote:
29 Mar 2021, 18:28
On the flip side of sellers not knowing what they have, occasionally you can pick up something good for very little because they've basically advertised it as "Keyboard" with a single blurry photo, but enough for you to work out or have a good guess at what it is.
The flip side of the flip side is that you can sometimes find those ads with blurry pictures and YOU know what the KB is and how much it's worth and then the auction hits $14,505 two seconds before close because someone else also knew what the KB is and how much it was worth, but has deeper pockets. Not that I'm bitter that I didn't win that unlabeled Focus FK-555 on ebay a couple days ago or anything. :D

I think that there are a couple different buyers out there:

* I want a good, vintage mechanical keyboard.
* I want a vintage mechanical keyboard to add to my collection.
* I want a vintage keyboard that's cheap so I can flip it in a week.

I'm a combination: I want a good vintage keyboard that I can play with and/or repair and then be able to sell it for what I paid for it or slightly more. I've also got a bunch of switches I haven't tried and want to.

Rayndalf

30 Mar 2021, 01:36

hellothere wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 00:40
Palatino wrote:
29 Mar 2021, 18:28
On the flip side of sellers not knowing what they have, occasionally you can pick up something good for very little because they've basically advertised it as "Keyboard" with a single blurry photo, but enough for you to work out or have a good guess at what it is.
The flip side of the flip side is that you can sometimes find those ads with blurry pictures and YOU know what the KB is and how much it's worth and then the auction hits $14,505 two seconds before close because someone else also knew what the KB is and how much it was worth, but has deeper pockets. Not that I'm bitter that I didn't win that unlabeled Focus FK-555 on ebay a couple days ago or anything. :D

I think that there are a couple different buyers out there:

* I want a good, vintage mechanical keyboard.
* I want a vintage mechanical keyboard to add to my collection.
* I want a vintage keyboard that's cheap so I can flip it in a week.

I'm a combination: I want a good vintage keyboard that I can play with and/or repair and then be able to sell it for what I paid for it or slightly more. I've also got a bunch of switches I haven't tried and want to.
Yeah. I'm in a similar place... I know just enough to know what can be done with a little ingenuity, but I rarely acknowledge that fact that I already have a backlog of projects.

I just see a board and think "I could do something neat with this" then I realize I need a part (a chip to convert serial or maybe another pro micro) and I get totally derailed. It's too easy to find new projects for "cheap" and ignore the fact that I still haven't put my F XT back together or finished my Tragicforce 68 build. But then I see a weird case that I think I can retrofit and I drop $100 (with shipping) on some weird German military rubber dome(?). To be fair I'm pretty certain it was originally designed for a G80-1800 assembly, and I got a TKC1800 build with a banged up case and some electrical issues for a "good" price, so...

To anyone who needs a reminder:
Don't make my mistake. There will always be another "project board" that you're convinced you'll never have a chance to buy again. But it's not worth having over a dozen project boards in various stages of disassembly. It doesn't matter how much cheaper it is to do the work yourself if you don't do the work. I won't take my own advice, but hopefully you will.
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Thorogrimm

30 Mar 2021, 01:46

The flip side of the flip side is that you can sometimes find those ads with blurry pictures and YOU know what the KB is and how much it's worth and then the auction hits $14,505 two seconds before close because someone else also knew what the KB is and how much it was worth, but has deeper pockets. Not that I'm bitter that I didn't win that unlabeled Focus FK-555 on ebay a couple days ago or anything. :D

I think that there are a couple different buyers out there:

* I want a good, vintage mechanical keyboard.
* I want a vintage mechanical keyboard to add to my collection.
* I want a vintage keyboard that's cheap so I can flip it in a week.

I'm a combination: I want a good vintage keyboard that I can play with and/or repair and then be able to sell it for what I paid for it or slightly more. I've also got a bunch of switches I haven't tried and want to.
I also got auction sniped the other day on a new old stock Packard Bell 5131c that was only £4
Livid.

micmil

30 Mar 2021, 02:46

I don't like how many of you are into the whole Packard Bell 5130 thing. That's MY super-niche batch of boards to exploit, you bastards!

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hellothere

30 Mar 2021, 03:09

Rayndalf wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 01:36
To anyone who needs a reminder:
Don't make my mistake. There will always be another "project board" that you're convinced you'll never have a chance to buy again. But it's not worth having over a dozen project boards in various stages of disassembly. It doesn't matter how much cheaper it is to do the work yourself if you don't do the work. I won't take my own advice, but hopefully you will.
Yes, I agree with you ... maybe. Partially?

I've gotten far enough along with this hobby to know if (some) keyboard X is rare. I've got enough experience with ebay to know that X should fetch between $Y and $Z, based on their sold prices. So, if I see X significantly lower than $Y, I'm going to see if I can buy it. However, I also do have around 25 keyboards that I have in various stages of repair and I'm running out of room. Additionally, there are things like this:

Oooh. Part for my Omnikey 102 came in today. Where's that PCB? Where did I stash that mounting plate? Why am I missing 10 switches? Where's that Enter key stabilizer? Oh, there's the mounting plate. Why did I repaint it? I need to get Bondo to fill some of the pits and do some sanding. Wait, where did I put my wet/dry sandpaper?

That's exactly what happened today. Deep sigh.

I've seen a couple of really cool looking keyboards that I've put bids on in the past couple of weeks. One was a Filco with white Alps and a copper color case. Another was a DataDesk TK-3000, also with white Alps. I also lost out on an [https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Alps-B ... -KFNLEA901]Alps buckling spring keyboard[/url], which I thought was pretty rare until I saw another one for sale a couple days later.

So. Cheap, rare, or something on my hit list I think I'd still try to buy. But I do need to get rid of some stuff. I happen to have a black two-tone BTC 5100c compact KB that I need to sell ...

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Thorogrimm

30 Mar 2021, 04:25

I happen to have a black two-tone BTC 5100c compact KB that I need to sell...
What layout is it?

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Thorogrimm

30 Mar 2021, 04:26

micmil wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 02:46
I don't like how many of you are into the whole Packard Bell 5130 thing. That's MY super-niche batch of boards to exploit, you bastards!
Aren't 5130's foam and foil? Or do you just mean the models with 5130-something?
And I still have yet to try one, I've heard about their amazing tacility and I've been wanting to add one to my collection since.

micmil

30 Mar 2021, 18:45

Thorogrimm wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 04:26
micmil wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 02:46
I don't like how many of you are into the whole Packard Bell 5130 thing. That's MY super-niche batch of boards to exploit, you bastards!
Aren't 5130's foam and foil? Or do you just mean the models with 5130-something?
And I still have yet to try one, I've heard about their amazing tacility and I've been wanting to add one to my collection since.
Nope. The Packard Bell/BTC 5130 (and a few other 51xx series) is BTC Dome with Slider. I think there were some F&F at one point but not the 5130.

Luckily they're still relatively cheap. Don't get a 5100c thinking it will give the same feel though. That's a much more linear dome, fairly mushy.

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hellothere

30 Mar 2021, 20:29

micmil wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 18:45
Thorogrimm wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 04:26
micmil wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 02:46
I don't like how many of you are into the whole Packard Bell 5130 thing. That's MY super-niche batch of boards to exploit, you bastards!
Aren't 5130's foam and foil? Or do you just mean the models with 5130-something?
And I still have yet to try one, I've heard about their amazing tacility and I've been wanting to add one to my collection since.
Nope. The Packard Bell/BTC 5130 (and a few other 51xx series) is BTC Dome with Slider. I think there were some F&F at one point but not the 5130.

Luckily they're still relatively cheap. Don't get a 5100c thinking it will give the same feel though. That's a much more linear dome, fairly mushy.
Spoiler:
DSC_03282.jpg
DSC_03282.jpg (1005.45 KiB) Viewed 567 times
YMMV. Mine's in almost new shape and it feels like a pretty decent tactile. If I was forced to use a "rubber dome" of some type, I'd pick this. One warning on the 5100c is that they had models with 6 pin DIN connectors. Don't get those.

My plan was to add a Soarer's Converter to my 5100c so I could make this thing even lighter. The problem is that the case doesn't have that much extra space. It's on the "to-do" list, tho :D

micmil mentions that these are cheap. The ones I've seen hover around $40 US on ebay. Also, while I'm not 100% sure they have the same switches, there's a person with massive quantities of new white 5100c keyboards selling for $45 each.

I got my 5100c based on hearing from Chyros that these had some of the best tactile switches, period. When I saw the little compact black one at a decent price, I kinda had to get it. The grey/black color combo is also very uncommon and I think it's really nice looking.

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Thorogrimm

30 Mar 2021, 20:48

Spoiler:
DSC_03282.jpg
YMMV. Mine's in almost new shape and it feels like a pretty decent tactile. If I was forced to use a "rubber dome" of some type, I'd pick this. One warning on the 5100c is that they had models with 6 pin DIN connectors. Don't get those.

My plan was to add a Soarer's Converter to my 5100c so I could make this thing even lighter. The problem is that the case doesn't have that much extra space. It's on the "to-do" list, tho :D

micmil mentions that these are cheap. The ones I've seen hover around $40 US on ebay. Also, while I'm not 100% sure they have the same switches, there's a person with massive quantities of new white 5100c keyboards selling for $45 each.

I got my 5100c based on hearing from Chyros that these had some of the best tactile switches, period. When I saw the little compact black one at a decent price, I kinda had to get it. The grey/black color combo is also very uncommon and I think it's really nice looking.
That is well cute. I'd love to get my hands on one in future

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Thorogrimm

30 Mar 2021, 20:50

micmil wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 18:45
Thorogrimm wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 04:26
micmil wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 02:46
I don't like how many of you are into the whole Packard Bell 5130 thing. That's MY super-niche batch of boards to exploit, you bastards!
Aren't 5130's foam and foil? Or do you just mean the models with 5130-something?
And I still have yet to try one, I've heard about their amazing tacility and I've been wanting to add one to my collection since.
Nope. The Packard Bell/BTC 5130 (and a few other 51xx series) is BTC Dome with Slider. I think there were some F&F at one point but not the 5130.

Luckily they're still relatively cheap. Don't get a 5100c thinking it will give the same feel though. That's a much more linear dome, fairly mushy.
Ah, I saw someone selling a 5130 for £28 but I wasn't sure if it was foam and foil. I gave that a miss in the end though

micmil

30 Mar 2021, 21:10

The tactile feel on the 5130 is way stronger than on the 5100c.
And just to be clear, the 5100c isn't crap as far as rubber domes go. There's way worse. The 5130 is just better though. To the point that if you check the workshop forum I have a 5130 I bought for spares and transplanted the domes into a 5100c. It's definitely a better feel, although I need to pop it back open and transplant the actual spacebar dome into it.

To be quite honest as much as I love these things the most expensive one I have was $40 and it was absolutely pristine except for a missing keycap. I wouldn't pay much more than that. At that point you're getting into low-cost mechanical territory and while I'd definitely take the 5130 over my Ajazz I'm not sure I'd give up my $60 Redragon for it. I like them but there's no reason for them to command a higher price than that.

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Thorogrimm

30 Mar 2021, 22:50

micmil wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 21:10
The tactile feel on the 5130 is way stronger than on the 5100c.
And just to be clear, the 5100c isn't crap as far as rubber domes go. There's way worse. The 5130 is just better though. To the point that if you check the workshop forum I have a 5130 I bought for spares and transplanted the domes into a 5100c. It's definitely a better feel, although I need to pop it back open and transplant the actual spacebar dome into it.

To be quite honest as much as I love these things the most expensive one I have was $40 and it was absolutely pristine except for a missing keycap. I wouldn't pay much more than that. At that point you're getting into low-cost mechanical territory and while I'd definitely take the 5130 over my Ajazz I'm not sure I'd give up my $60 Redragon for it. I like them but there's no reason for them to command a higher price than that.
Damn. I missed out.
What I did manage to get though was a Silitek dome with slider keyboard. Are they any good?

micmil

31 Mar 2021, 01:01

Thorogrimm wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 22:50
Damn. I missed out.
What I did manage to get though was a Silitek dome with slider keyboard. Are they any good?
Ya know... MAYBE I know? Looking into it the Silitek dome with slider was used on a few Atari keyboards. I had an XEGS when I was super young and remember the keyboard sucked, but then again I was like six years old so take that for what it's worth.

User avatar
Spockmaster

31 Mar 2021, 02:01

micmil wrote:
30 Mar 2021, 21:10
The tactile feel on the 5130 is way stronger than on the 5100c.
And just to be clear, the 5100c isn't crap as far as rubber domes go. There's way worse. The 5130 is just better though. To the point that if you check the workshop forum I have a 5130 I bought for spares and transplanted the domes into a 5100c. It's definitely a better feel, although I need to pop it back open and transplant the actual spacebar dome into it.

To be quite honest as much as I love these things the most expensive one I have was $40 and it was absolutely pristine except for a missing keycap. I wouldn't pay much more than that. At that point you're getting into low-cost mechanical territory and while I'd definitely take the 5130 over my Ajazz I'm not sure I'd give up my $60 Redragon for it. I like them but there's no reason for them to command a higher price than that.
I picked one up last month in really good condition for $29 shipped. There's still some good deals to be had on ebay, but I also saw a NOS one for like $150 a few weeks ago. I hope no one bought that.

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Thorogrimm

31 Mar 2021, 07:14

Ya know... MAYBE I know? Looking into it the Silitek dome with slider was used on a few Atari keyboards. I had an XEGS when I was super young and remember the keyboard sucked, but then again I was like six years old so take that for what it's worth.
I'll put up a review or something when I receive mine because I've seen very little information about it

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