Looking for a full-sized keyboard with ISO-DE layout and media keys (and silent red switches)

enricodude

22 May 2022, 21:02

Howdie everyone,

I don't quite know what to do and would appreciate and helpful advice.

So I recently bought and tried the new-ish G80-3000N. It has the perfect keyboard layout imho:
- ISO-DE
- full-sized
- media keys (i.e. volume control)

I loved typing on the MX Silent Reds. It was pretty great when I tried it for a few minutes over 2 days... but I had to return it. :(

I just could not get used to the sound. Seriously, as great as the feel of the keyboard was, the scoring for the sound metric was somehow flipped 1:1 on the measuring scale because of some annoying resonance.
It was incredibly pervasive and metallic. It wasn't the typical springy "ping" sound, more like a metallic resonance that came after every single key press. Quite hollow too.
So I returned it.

I am now looking for the next best thing.
So.Would anyone have any recommendations for a kb that has these features?
  • Silent Reds (they do not have to be Cherry MX switches)... no, not reds, too clacky imho.
  • full sized ISO-DE layout
  • media keys for volume control
  • price range... well, up to 200 EUR but I wouldn't mind paying less, just saying :)
  • Would be preferable if it is available for purchase sometime soon-ish (and not like the rare unicorns that are Ducky KBs which haven't been in stock since 81723 months). :)
Or should I buy the G80-3000N again and lube it... and do some kind of "foam mod" which seems to be the big hit for this ping/resonance situations?
Or should I somehow create the one I want by ordering custom parts and assemble it myself...?

User avatar
hellothere

22 May 2022, 21:25

https://www.keychron.com/collections/ke ... -keyboards
Most have an option to be hot-swappable. Most have a Bluetooth option. They're also inexpensive.

https://www.caseking.de/en/glorious-gmm ... -1690.html
True full-size keyboard.

Probably a few out there, but I can't read German.

User avatar
guidemetothelight

23 May 2022, 12:03

hellothere wrote:
22 May 2022, 21:25
https://www.keychron.com/collections/ke ... -keyboards
Most have an option to be hot-swappable. Most have a Bluetooth option. They're also inexpensive.
Iam a German myself , and i have very good experiences with keychron boards. (own one myself and bought many many more for friends , girlfriend and family) (all very happy with it)
Inexpensive, good quality , nice design , good sound out of the box but u can mod them very easily. (I recommend the pe foam mod and lubing your stabs , but they come often prelubed from the factory)

Here is a link to the keychron page where u can find a selection of many models , iam sure there is one that fits u :)

Grüße aus Süddeutschland !

Edit: They use Gateron Pro Reds, which come prelubed from the factory ( not as good as self lubed with krytox, but better then nothing)

enricodude

23 May 2022, 18:05

Hello hello everyone. Yes guten Abend. :)

Thank you for your replies. @guideme... Are you referring to hellothere's link? Or did you intend to post another link?
Because I the ones they posted are like full-sized ... but compact, if that makes sense. Had no idea this kind of "full-size" existed :D
I rather not differ too much from the keyboards at the office, which have the good old boring dedicated numpad on the side (and that space between the letters+enter block, then the block with the arrow keys and the navigational keys above... finally the numeric keys to the right.

Maybe my wishes are too specific. :/

User avatar
hellothere

23 May 2022, 23:42

enricodude wrote:
23 May 2022, 18:05
I rather not differ too much from the keyboards at the office, which have the good old boring dedicated numpad on the side (and that space between the letters+enter block, then the block with the arrow keys and the navigational keys above... finally the numeric keys to the right.

Maybe my wishes are too specific. :/
Specificity helps in the mechanical keyboard world. You've just shot down Keychron as an option because they don't have a "regular" 102+ key keyboard, their option is this. The GMMK, however, is still in the running, as they do have a "regular" 102+ key keyboard, but you have to play with their customizer tool.

I completely forgot that the SteelSeries Apex Pro is available with a German layout. If you want smooth, non-clicky switches and don't mind a wired, non-hotswap keyboard, this is your best bet ... but it's a little more than your budget. I'd say it's worth it, as I have one of these in US layout.

User avatar
guidemetothelight

24 May 2022, 07:55

enricodude wrote:
23 May 2022, 18:05
Hello hello everyone. Yes guten Abend. :)

Thank you for your replies. @guideme... Are you referring to hellothere's link? Or did you intend to post another link?
Hey Man, sorry , apparently i didnt bother to press strg c :D but if the non traditional layout of the keychrons bothers u , maybe something like that
https://nzxt.com/de-DE/product/function-german-iso

is the right thing for u ? Traditional Layout, Hotswap, detachable USB-C Cable, Gateron Red Linears from the factory. Also ISO DE layout.

Best Regards,

Nick :D

enricodude

27 May 2022, 18:10

TL;DR: I re-bought the model I sent back but will give it a good try with modding after it arrives. At least the "tape mod" under the PCB and foam mod.



But I wanted to say, I appreciate you guys carrying the thread on.

About the GM(M)K custom keyboards. Their case/housing reminds me too much of my current Sharkoon kb. I do not like it much (anymore). Plus it does not have dedicated media keys, which is what I am looking. And which is another point of "something new" i learned, because I did not anticipiate the volume keys reachable via a FN-shortcut is a synonymous feature to dedicated volume keys to someone else. It's just a nitpicky bit I rather try to fulfill that requirement than discard it.

And I did some more research: it could have been a Keychron Q6 but seeing how that hasn't been released yet, I rather not wait for the release and then pay at least 150 EUR or upwards for the first batch which will–undoubtedly and not at all because of Keychron's abilities–have its usual 1st batch problems. Plus, it's not really clear if the Q6 gets and ISO/DE version.



Thank you.

User avatar
guidemetothelight

29 May 2022, 01:27

enricodude wrote:
27 May 2022, 18:10
TL;DR: I re-bought the model I sent back but will give it a good try with modding after it arrives. At least the "tape mod" under the PCB and foam mod.

But I wanted to say, I appreciate you guys carrying the thread on.

Thank you.
Hey ,
probably thats the best option for you, since its the keyboard u wanted packaged with the fun of voiding the waranty instantly :D
all jokes aside, good call ! enjoy it and feel free to report your journey on here :D

Also , your welcome , happy to help !

User avatar
ingmar

29 May 2022, 08:16

According to /r/MechanicalKeyboards/ where a user claims to have contacted Keychron's support, all Q models will get ISO layout, too. I must say the Q6 ISO looks very tempting.

A knob version as with the Q5 shown here … Image

… would be icing on the cake.

User avatar
Muirium
µ

29 May 2022, 18:01

I dunno man, you can’t trust all you read about Q on the internet. ;)

User avatar
ingmar

29 May 2022, 20:40

Probabaly not. But since the Q3 already comes in ANSI and ISO variants, with and without knob, I remain somewhat optimistic …

(That said, you certainly can't trust Q, even though he was pretty disappointing as of late in ST Picard.)

User avatar
ingmar

01 Jun 2022, 07:00

Renders just leaked … The Keychron Q6 will be released in a knob version (both ANSI and ISO) on June 21st 2022.

Image

Finally a 110% layout I am excited about. (QMK/VIA support OOTB!)

User avatar
hellothere

02 Jun 2022, 16:44

The only thing that I find lacking is that neither the Q3 or Q6 have Bluetooth or other wireless. If I wanted another MX-compatible keyboard, that'd be a deal-breaker for me.

The Q6 will probably be priced around the same as the Q3: $184 US.

User avatar
ingmar

02 Jun 2022, 20:51

I am pro-wired all the way, don't want to have to charge yet another device. All BT keyboards I've seen were slower, outright unreliable at times … That said, if wireless is important to you there's always the K-series (or other vendors, obviously), in this case the https://www.keychron.com/products/keych ... l-keyboard. Much cheaper, too.

User avatar
Muirium
µ

02 Jun 2022, 21:27

It takes two to Bluetooth: it also depends on the host. Crap receiver and yeah you’re going to have a rough time even with the best wireless keyboard at the other end.

I’ve used Hasu powered Bluetooth HHKBs for many years, and many million keystrokes… with iPads, MacBook Pros and Airs. They’re solid. No noticeable delays at all. I’d go nuts if there were!

But that’s my setup. I kick back with my keyboards for long typing sessions, which is ideal for wireless, and I use built in Bluetooth hardware, which definitely does the trick. I did use a USB Bluetooth dongle on my iMac G4 and first gen Mac Pro long ago, and yeah that was flakier. Best place with the Mac Pro wound up being on the back of my chintzy plastic Dell P2415Q monitor. The big aluminium cheese grater’s case was killing the Bluetooth signal!

Shorle

02 Jun 2022, 23:28

I think it's fair game to try to mod your 3000N first but some boards are too far gone and can't be saved economically - at least that was my conclusion with my rabbit whole starter Qisan magicforce 69.
If a used one off ebay / EKA is an option for you voiding the warranty might be easier.

Also you have other options:
A.: Cherry also has the Cherry MX Board 3.0 S or the Board 1.0 checking all you criteria but probably won't ping as bad because plastics.

B.: Akko has some ISO-DE keycaps in the pipeline that are postponed due to Asias Harbor lockdown but once they arrive they seem like a nice option for you since they'll be offered with ISO keyboards as well. Get an idea of their lineup here: Akko 5108S & 3108v2 https://akkogear.de/collections/keyboards?page=3 ff

C.: Classical entry enthusiast boards for Germans in 2018 were :duck: duckies and they recently released a new version, the Ducky One 3: https://www.caseking.de/ducky-one-3-mat ... -1626.html (those keycaps are hideous though)

Speaking of hideous: I am glad Keychron didn't mess up their Q6 like they did their Q5 with that knob variant .

User avatar
hellothere

03 Jun 2022, 00:59

ingmar wrote:
02 Jun 2022, 20:51
I am pro-wired all the way, don't want to have to charge yet another device. All BT keyboards I've seen were slower, outright unreliable at times … That said, if wireless is important to you there's always the K-series (or other vendors, obviously), in this case the https://www.keychron.com/products/keych ... l-keyboard. Much cheaper, too.
I've got about 1 and 3/4 K6s. It's a long story that really isn't fun.

The only Bluetooth keyboards I have used for a long stretch of time are Apple's. They were annoying to reconnect/re-pair after a battery charge (removeable AAs), especially in an office that had several other Macs. I haven't used the other four or five Bluetooth/wireless keyboards I have to any great extent. I mention elsewhere that one keyboard I had that supported 3 different Bluetooth devices at a time was a bit temperamental. The Bluetooth/wireless mice, touchpads, and trackballs I've used have also been occasionally, but consistently, annoying at times.

One thing that I'm pleasantly surprised about is that my iPhone connects to Bluetooth in my 2015 Nissan without any problems. I paired it once and if my phone is playing music or a podcast, the car instantly picks it up.

Post Reply

Return to “Keyboards”