Pok3r, fully programmable 60%

[matt3o]

It is said to be fully programmable, both FN and PN layers. Backlight granularity down to the single cap. dip-switch to select up to 3 layouts.

too good to be true? time will tell.



original post: https://www.facebook.com/Vortexgear/pos ... 6209321758

[scottc]

Those keycaps look - dare I say it - quite nice!

[Daniel Beardsmore]

PCB mount? Noooo :(

It just looks like someone pulled the top of the case off. At least G80 keyboards have a nice black-painted (?) PCB under the keys, even if the jumper wires look like staples have fallen between the keys.

[matt3o]

the final product will be plate mounted, but I love the "open case" design.

[JBert]

Those keycaps look - dare I say it - quite nice!

They look like they have some kind of grainy rubber on top. I'm not sold yet. The lower case might also attract more dirt for a keyboard on the go.

In other news, the GH60 group buy is still not moving.

[matt3o]

the keycaps seem PBT + PC POM legends.

Re GH60 (ah... ahahah... ah... [hysteric laughter])

[scottc]

Poker 3 coming out before GH60!
3!
Half-life 3 before GH60 too?

[Laser]

To me, the keycaps look exactly like those vortex doubleshots (pbt + pom for backlit support) that run recently on massdrop.

[matt3o]

yeah sorry, I meant POM not PC.

This is it http://keypuller.com/pbt-pom-double-shot-by-vortex/

[Muirium]

the final product will be plate mounted, but I love the "open case" design.

Aw. The original Poker was so much better than the sequel, precisely for its modding ability. Any idea what the cutouts will be like on the plate? If they're plain rectangles, the community behind its design deserves a nice friendly slap with a wet mackerel on each and every cheek.

Anyway, no HHKB style Fn = no worry for my wallet. Or worrying about the nightmares involved in actually programming the controller. (Flash, right? Or a Windows EXE!)

But all that said, it's still a far nicer looking and more sensible and capable board than Matias'es'is's 60%, which took every bad choice on the table and seized them with a gruesome gusto, alas.

[Madhias]

It just looks like someone pulled the top of the case off. At least G80 keyboards have a nice black-painted (?) PCB under the keys, even if the jumper wires look like staples have fallen between the keys.

The case looks exactly like the one Pexon sold (and sells), even with a plate it looks more open than other cases which are higher on the side. I quite like this look

Spoiler:

[matt3o]

I'm pretty sure the PCB is "poker" compatible.

with hard switches (green) I prefer the FN on the thumb (in lieu of ALT) or on capslock. I really can't use it with my pinky.

I don't find Matias's design bad, actually quite enjoyable. The only problem is that it is not programmable.

[Muirium]

That fat bottom row on the Matias is among the worst things I have ever seen on a mechanical keyboard. All the worse when it's on a little compact! There's no way we could ever upgrade caps.

Judge it like it was an MX board. Don't grade on a curve. We wind up stuck in the shit when we do that.

[matt3o]

I'm glad matias didn't do yet another 60% layout. At least they tried. The PCB is alps and mx compatible and you can customize the layout quite a bit. The bottom row is PBT so at least they are durable. It has its merits, I'm sorry you don't see them. I find tagging it as crap just because it doesn't follow the "sacred rules of keyboard manufacturing" unfair.

[Muirium]

I don't think it's crap, but I do think it is deeply compromised by the result of several bad decisions piled on top of one another. I really wish he hadn't done that horrible bottom row. And I have grave doubts about the controller. Despite the fact we have several open and universal ones that we created ourselves!

The bit where I said shit was to do with how much we temper our criticism. It's all too natural to let something slide because it's from someone we like, or it's the underdog. But that's the path to mediocrity. Or shit, indeed! When something's a mistake, it's better for all of us if we can call it a mistake, rather than fear upsetting anyone.

[cookie]

Ahhh thankfully no HHKB style FN key! Otherwise my money would be in serious danger
All in all I like the Poker 3, I also saw the post on facebook and was wondering what they concider as "Programmable"
More informations about the caps would be nice but time will show!

Poker 3 coming out before GH60!
3!
Half-life 3 before GH60 too?

I had to laugh so hard

[lowpoly]

I should have patented that case design in 2008.

[matt3o]

you should have open sourced instead!

[Muirium]

A viral license is even better at scaring off commercial competitors than a patent!

[cookie]

I should have patented that case design in 2008.

You initially came up with this design?

[lowpoly]

you should have open sourced instead!

2008 was too early. Now it's too late. Unless we ditch crowdfunding.

You initially came up with this design?

Something similar at least.

[Muirium]

ENJOY YOUR FEELING, Lowpoly!

[jacobolus]

Aw. The original Poker was so much better than the sequel, precisely for its modding ability. Any idea what the cutouts will be like on the plate? If they're plain rectangles, the community behind its design deserves a nice friendly slap with a wet mackerel on each and every cheek.

I’m sure less than 1% of the people who ever buy a Poker care about this feature. Wacky shape plate cutouts are a total gimmick IMO.

[cookie]

I am curios about the price tbh, I concidered the original poker 1 relatively pricy if you thing about the material used, build quality and cap quality. I mean the first poker was a pcb with a flimsy shell and shitty abs caps... well it turned out to be the a game changer among the 60% boards!

To leave the layout standard ansi was genious! I am actually wondering if they did this on purpose or out of lazyness?
As far as I know it was the first largely available 60% board which was actually affordable and due to it's standard layout insanely easy to mod with caps and stuff. Shortly after it's inital success you coul'd buy cnc made aluminium cases for it!

The fun thing is that a poker can easily top the price of an HHKB if you start modding it with all kind of stuff

I'd love to have a 60% cherry board to rotate with my hhkbs sometimes but I really need the HHKB style FN key tho.

[matt3o]

it will be the usual $100 I guess. There will be many options for keycaps, so maybe some versions will be more expensive based on the keycap material.

I'm used to FN in left-alt position, so if this is really going to be fully programmable, it could be the final 60%

@cookie, there's the pure if you want the HHKB style FN

[jacobolus]

I don't think [the Matias 60% keyboard is] crap, but I do think it is deeply compromised by the result of several bad decisions piled on top of one another. I really wish he hadn't done that horrible bottom row. And I have grave doubts about the controller. Despite the fact we have several open and universal ones that we created ourselves! It's all too natural to let something slide because it's from someone we like, or it's the underdog. But that's the path to mediocrity. Or shit, indeed!

No, the path to mediocrity is copying what everyone else has already done. Trying new things, even when it turns out to be a failure, is the only way forward.

I find your overall criticism here really disappointing. It boils down to “I like this particular way of doing X, Y, and Z feature that already exist, so any deviation from those is bad.”

An extra-wide spacebar is actually a very substantial ergonomic improvement, and well worth trying on a standard-layout board. I don’t think the rest of the bottom row necessarily needs to be equally wide, but it doesn’t really hurt and arguably has aesthetic advantages. The squished arrow keys are a feature taken from Apple laptop keyboards, which are incredibly popular (they are certainly not perfect, but clearly many people appreciate them, and some of their layout decisions are quite clever given the constraints). For someone used to using Apple keyboards this could be a really great alternative with basically no learning curve or back-and-forth transition cost.

The controller has certain advantages too: from what I understand, most of the custom controllers have a larger power draw than most stock keyboard controllers. Having a semi-locked-down firmware and microcontroller makes the keyboard much easier to secure, and there are environments where that matters. Arbitrary macro recording is usually a boon, but in some cases, such as for professional video game players who need verifiably non-cheating equipment it’s a liability. For novice users, macro recording features can be a confusing mess. Matias needs to test their keyboard firmware on every kind of machine, and surely has some advantage in resources over a few amateurs working on open source projects in their spare time (no disrespect to the open source firmware developers, who are wonderful). Matias support is accessible, friendly, and accommodating: they stand behind their products, and bend over backward to make sure people have a good experience; with a DIY product or similar support is often a bit of a crapshoot.

There are trade-offs involved here. If you don’t like the particular trade-offs chosen, no one is forcing you to buy their keyboard. Luckily, there are a bunch of other keyboards available or upcoming which make different trade-offs, which you could choose instead. It’s definitely not for me personally (I build keyboards from scratch, by hand, from the scraps of boards from the 80s). But I really want to see people keep pushing different ideas in different directions. The results a few years down the line after we’ve all had a chance to learn from a few iterations can only be positive.

[ماء]

The case is still same since X top case like hhk seems looks good

[cookie]

@matt3o yeah I know, still hope that you will sell me the face-U pcb without the greens!
As far as I know it has the option to put the HHKB style FN key, but the next big thing will be the caps... Caps for the pure is soo hard to find tho

[matt3o]

@matt3o yeah I know, still hope that you will sell me the face-U pcb without the greens

yes I can do that, I need the green for another project so I can desolder them if you want the PCB. PM me if interested.

[Muirium]

@Jacobolus: I see two critical flaws with the Matias 60%'s bottom row. The biggest one is that it's eternally stuck with whatever caps Matias can make for it. So far, his caps have never gone beyond mediocre. That's a piercing alarm bell for me. With a lame bottom row, what can you do with the rest of the board? Mismatching heights and profiles is a project stopper.

Secondly, it's plain hideous. I'd like this attempt to succeed, but Im certainly not buying one and I can't honestly recommend it to anyone else either. Matias could really use some success in the small batch custom realm, but this attempt looks almost as if he'd asked our advice and flipped it 180° on purpose! It's daring, I guess, but with a strong whiff of foolish.

As for MX stem swapping, I've answered questions from several inquisitive newbs here about that just in recent weeks. It's a feature that's well worth having, if "only" for those starting out and wanting to experiment with ergo clears and the like before committing further. Right now, there's a dearth of PCB mount boards available for custom-shy budget-conscious beginners. (Tried finding a reliable link for an appropriate Cherry board for sale in the UK?) The original Poker was a standout board in that respect.