F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards

Ellipse

28 Apr 2019, 00:41

Sorry Matt it is not available.

Ellipse

28 Apr 2019, 20:55

Mystery revealed: In the earlier photos, the left cap is the original Model F cap and the right is the new test cap.

I also posted information on the grease mod on my web site blog, for those interested in a quieter Model F Keyboard:
https://www.modelfkeyboards.com/a-quiet ... -keyboard/

Copied below:
In addition to the floss mod described on the Geekhack/Deskthority keyboard forums, another mod to consider is the grease mod, researched and described by the below YouTube user. Also in my research I have found that pressing the springs down all the way on the flipper (normally there is a 0.2 to 0.3mm gap) reduces the ringing. I do not offer and have not tried any of these mods but below is some information to consider.

The purpose of the grease mod is to reduce the reverberation/ringing after each key is pressed.

His comments are copied directly below.

Apply Synco Superlube on the inside of the spring with a metal probe…just enough to dampen the vibration

As an experiment, I tried a few switches on an XT F. I did nothing to the first XT F in the video…you can hear the sound I’m referring to…it’s like a super-loud, much more intense, sharper and “drier” version of what my (in superb condition) 1988-1989 Model M boards sound like. Then on the second board, I did the Alps spring lube trick on the keypad only. The feel is the same, the click sounds great (to me), the actuation force is ever so slightly less. But the annoying (to me) spring noise virtually disappears.

video 1 – detailed key sound (lubed keypad; unmodified other keys):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kha_cvhZBp8



video 2 – typing demo of the unmodified F:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1j1g-xLF6k



video 3 – typing demo of the fully spring lubed F:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqvr-U9CEuY

Zimyver

30 Apr 2019, 14:02

Presumably you could achieve similar dampening just by putting lube on the end of the spring.

Ellipse

05 May 2019, 20:36

Mass assembly continues at the factory. This photo of in progress F62 inner assemblies is from a week ago (the factories had a holiday break this first week of May).

We are still aiming for completion of all keyboards by the end of this month.

As noted earlier the factory caught a production error in the curve radius of the bottom inner assemblies and has been correcting all those parts before those parts can be assembled. Because of this error it was not practical to ship the first 500 keyboards first so now the expectation is that all the keyboards can ship soon after the end of this month.

Also as a reminder I have ordered extras as part of the early bird round so you can still order a keyboard and accessories and have it ship as part of the early bird round!

Meanwhile the factory is assembling all the other parts. So far the spring assembly and inner assembly closing is being done by custom built machines and the key, barrel, and spring installation is being done manually (they noted that the pick and place machine design for these custom components would exceed the cost of labor).
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darkcruix

06 May 2019, 11:43

Good news! Thanks for the update.

In (very rough) timelines this is what is likely to happen?:
Early June: All assembled keyboards will be loaded into a container and go from China on the travel to the US
Mid-July: The assembled keyboards will arrive in US and released after normally a week
End-July: Ellipse has the container with all keyboards available
End-July: Ellipse starts to dye-sub the low number keyboards
Mid-August: First 50-100 keyboards start to get shipped fully assembled

I know this timeline will change, but I wanted to understand, if that is the approximation of what is going to happen next, if all goes well?

Ellipse

09 May 2019, 02:38

Yes that is the expectation for the timeline from here

latemodel24

09 May 2019, 03:34

When is the absolute latest I could put an order in for a f77.

Ellipse

11 May 2019, 22:05

Sorry, not sure latemodel.

Ellipse

11 May 2019, 22:16

Some news on the bottom inner assembly front. While fixing the bottom inner assemblies the stamping tool broke, but now it has been fixed and it produces a curve that is to spec. They are now able to resume correction of the parts. Attached is a photo of an unfinished compact bottom inner assembly showing a within tolerance match to the specified radius. The curve tolerance is important because an accurate curve allows a more equal spacing of each barrel between the top and bottom inner assemblies. Too much or too little space between the sandwiched metal plates would have affected the sound. IBM Model F plates maintained the same radius tolerance even 35 years after they were made!

The expectation is still for all assembly to finish by month end, though the now-resolved bottom inner assembly issue may delay things by a week or two.
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darkcruix

15 May 2019, 14:41

How does the dye-sub process come along?
I wonder, if there was already done a complete keycap set and pictures can be shared :)

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Shifty

16 May 2019, 18:29

Are there any alternative 1.75u key legends? I tend to use the caps lock key as a function key, but a control legend would be fine too.

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Zed

16 May 2019, 22:18

Shifty wrote:
16 May 2019, 18:29
Are there any alternative 1.75u key legends? I tend to use the caps lock key as a function key, but a control legend would be fine too.
There is a 1.75U "Control" in the HHKB kit Shifty.

Ellipse

17 May 2019, 03:38

Here are some more photos of mass assembly at the factory. As noted earlier, mass assembly was slowed due to the bottom inner assembly parts needing to be re-curved, and then the stamping tool to re-curve these parts broke (has since been repaired). As requested they are storing the assembled flippers/springs in open air (not in sealed bags) to help maximize the quality of the Model F sound (exposure to moving air/humidity). Also pictured is a production styrofoam for shipping the classic case keyboards (the ultra compact variations will get another type of foam packaging).

darkcruix - no new updates yet on the dye sublimation.
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Zed

17 May 2019, 18:42

Zed wrote:
16 May 2019, 22:18
Shifty wrote:
16 May 2019, 18:29
Are there any alternative 1.75u key legends? I tend to use the caps lock key as a function key, but a control legend would be fine too.
There is a 1.75U "Control" in the HHKB kit Shifty.
We have a slot on the jig for another 1.75U so I will also add a 'Fn' or 'Function' (whichever ends up looking best) key.

duncancmt

21 May 2019, 03:58

I want to place an order (shipping separately from my keyboard is OK) for a bunch of extra keycaps. Should I wait to see what are the final legends that will be available? Or should I just go ahead and order using the information that Zed has already posted in this thread?

Ellipse

21 May 2019, 04:30

ok to order with Zed's layouts

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depletedvespene

21 May 2019, 15:33

Ellipse wrote:
21 May 2019, 04:30
ok to order with Zed's layouts
Ok, then! I'll start making my laundry list.

Just give us a quick reminder of which keycaps have to be bought in a pack and which ones have to be ordered individually (also: are there restrictions on keycap colours?).

Ellipse

22 May 2019, 01:36

The "pack only" keys are the ones in the sets in the store (Mac, HHKB, front-printed F1 etc.). The 1.75U keys cost $10 each (10 units of $1 increments). I believe the others are all available individually.

daijoubu

23 May 2019, 09:25

Hi Ellipse, do you see it an issue with the Trump tax affecting goods coming in from China?

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Zed

26 May 2019, 01:20

Final artwork for all of the extra key sets with a few minor additions and changes.

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F XT Extra Keys ren C.png
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depletedvespene

26 May 2019, 01:50

Lookin' good! Will all the extra keys (that are pebble in this image) be available in the other colors as well? (especially dark gray)

(now I have to go back and check what I did order in the beginning, so I can determine what of each of those screenshots I want to order)

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Zed

26 May 2019, 02:40

depletedvespene wrote:
26 May 2019, 01:50
Lookin' good! Will all the extra keys (that are pebble in this image) be available in the other colors as well? (especially dark gray)

(now I have to go back and check what I did order in the beginning, so I can determine what of each of those screenshots I want to order)
Thanks! I believe any color except for black is up for grabs for printing but the Ellipse will have to verify.

cods

26 May 2019, 13:35

Wow, they look amazing!

So, now I’m wondering if the keyboard ordered is in the HHKB layout (all mine are, with split right shift) do they come with the HHKB keyset on the board? Front print?

<starts checking what keys I’ve already ordered>

Takashi

26 May 2019, 16:37

Zed wrote:
26 May 2019, 01:20
Final artwork for all of the extra key sets with a few minor additions and changes.
....
I'm really confused about this. Around ~1 year ago I ordered an optional CM-style kit (see page 112 for picture) of the keys. But this seems like its not an option anymore? I did this as a separate order (Order #6014, 60$).

What will happen with this now?

Edit: I was too quick with this one. I just noticed it actually does exist. I asked for this configuration + blue arrow keys. This is a combination of everything in "F77 Num Pad #5" plus the blue arrow keys in "Mopar Blue" ... right? :)

Edit2: My order consists of four orders already. I'm getting confused about my own order haha :)
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Ellipse

28 May 2019, 04:36

Yes all project key colors are available for sublimation except black.

cods - HHKB front printing is not part of the HHKB key set but is available as individual keys with front printing. HHKB key set includes the keys specified on the HHKB key set product page, no front printing on this key set.

Takashi - Yes (replied over email as well)

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depletedvespene

29 May 2019, 04:36

Forgive me all y'all, for I have become senile and easily confused (and even more of a dick than usual). So, for my peace of mind, let me ask if I have gotten this straight, and then tell me if that is not the case.

On my order for an F77 keyboard, I asked for:
- Layout/Flipper Placement: ISO Enter (vertical enter and split Left Shift)
- Keys: International layout (pls specify which one on the checkout page) ⇒ Spanish (Latin America)
- Right side block:: Print/ScrLock/Pause/Ins/Del etc. keys, cursor keys

Now, given what was said in page 128, I'll be getting a set like this (not counting the difference in the national layout):
basecapset.png
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(note that I haven't seen any render for an ISO Enter key)


Now, in order for me to adjust the keyboard to fit my exact whims, I'll need to order a bunch of keys from the three "F XT Extra" pictures posted above. SOME of those can only be purchased in sets, some can be ordered individually. If I've gotten this correctly, it's as follows:

- Front print F row: as a set of 12 keys.
- Industrial SSK: as a set of 12 keys.
- HHKB: as a set of 6 keys.
- HHKB front print: as a set of 27 keys.
- Apple/Mac: as a set of 6 keys.
- Mopar blue: as a set of 8 keys.
- Extras: 22 keys, can be bought individually.
- Novelties: 6 keys, can be bought individually.

- F77 numpad #1: not offered independently, as it's contained in the base set.
- F77 numpad #2: not offered independently, as it's contained in the base set.


- F77 numpad #3: as a delta set of 3 keys.
- F77 numpad #4: as a full set of 15 keys.
- F77 numpad #5: as a delta set of 12 keys.
- F77 numpad #6: as a delta set of 12 keys.
- SSK numpad: as a set of 22 keys.

- Icons: 39 keys, can be bought individually.
- 4704: as a set of 10 keys.
- Terminal: as a set of 27 keys.
- Ortholinear: as a set of 25 keys (otherwise it'd make no sense to have two of each mod).
- Ergodox: as a set of 33 keys.
- Media text: as a set of 7 keys.
- Media icons: as a set of 7 keys.

(it worries me that 1U Tab and Backtab seem to not be available independently)

When it comes to colors: Industrial SSK and Mopar Blue will be offered only in blue (because DUH). For all the other sets, pearl alphas should be available in pearl only, pebble alphas should be available in pebble only, and all non-alphas (legends or icons) should be available in pebble and dark gray (and perhaps blue, too?).

Pricing: for sets, for each individual key? For those, based on size only, or color as well? Anticipating the difficulties some people will have when ordering their laundry lists of custom keys, would it be wise to make a simple webpage with some kind of WYSIWYO selector?


Thanks (I do look forward to having a keyboard with nothing but icons on the mods!).

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depletedvespene

29 May 2019, 05:03

Also, I am quite probably a monster for asking this now, but... how 'bout an F77 numpad #5², with icons instead of the legends Ins, Del, ... etc?

(can't believe it took me this long to realize that)

Ellipse

29 May 2019, 13:56

Some more photos from the factory. Here is a fixture that holds the unfinished inner assemblies with installed flippers and springs.

Sorry depleted, no more new legends.
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2019 05 29 fixture to hold unfinished inner assemblies (2).jpg
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darkcruix

29 May 2019, 14:43

Thanks for the photos! I am so looking forward holding some of them in my hands and hearing those clicking noises and feeling the bump with every click... 2019 is the year !!!!

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depletedvespene

29 May 2019, 15:58

I wonder if we should start a separate thread to share the intended layout designs for our F62/F77 (and later pictures of them!).

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