xwhatsit beamspring converter board "not found"

PancakeMSTR

15 Jul 2019, 03:21

Hi,
I just finished (badly, SMD sucks so hard) soldering up a Beamspring -USB-5251 Rev 4. When I plug it into my computer (win 10), it says "USB device not recognized) and when I try to start up the capsense utility it says "No Controller found"

Here's the parts list:

Code: Select all

                            Sheet 1: Beamspring-USB

Id Designator                 Package         Quantity Designation Price  Total
 1 CON1                       USB_MINI_B             1 USB-MINI-B   $1.42  $1.42 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/690-005-299-043/151-1206-1-ND/4312192/?itemSeq=297384381
 2 U2                         tsot-6                 1 DAC101S101   $3.16  $3.16 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/DAC101S101CIMK%2fNOPB/DAC101S101CIMK%2fNOPBCT-ND/953475/?itemSeq=297384429
 3 U1                         TQFP32                 1 ATMEGA32U2   $7.00  $7.00 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ATMEGA32U2-AUR/ATMEGA32U2-AURCT-ND/3789462/?itemSeq=297384636
 6 U6                         so-14                  1 LM339A       $0.48  $0.48 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/LM339ADT/497-1586-1-ND/592080/?itemSeq=297384826
 7 C3,C4                      SM0805                 2 22pF         $0.01  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/C0805C220J5GACTU/399-1113-1-ND/411388/?itemSeq=297385114
 8 C10,C9,C8,C11,C6,C7,C2,C12 SM0805                 8 0.1uF        $0.01  $0.08 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL21F104ZBCNNNC/1276-1007-1-ND/3889093/?itemSeq=297385195
 9 R4                         SM0805                 1 4.7K         $0.01  $0.01 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/RC0805JR-074K7L/311-4.7KARCT-ND/731274/?itemSeq=297385269
10 R3,R17                     SM0805                 2 20K          $0.01  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ERA-6AEB203V/P20KDACT-ND/1465978/?itemSeq=297385292
11 R1,R16,R2                  SM0805                 3 10K          $0.01  $0.03 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/RNCF0805DTE10K0/RNCF0805DTE10K0CT-ND/2687083/?itemSeq=297385332
12 C1                         SM0805                 1 1uF          $0.02  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL21B105KAFNNNE/1276-1066-1-ND/3889152/?itemSeq=297385348
13 R15                        SM0805                 1 47K          $0.01  $0.01 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ERA-6AEB473V/P47KDACT-ND/1465987/?itemSeq=297385373
14 C5                         SM0805                 1 4.7uF        $0.02  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL21A475KOFNNNE/1276-1065-1-ND/3889151/?itemSeq=297385412
15 R6,R5                      SM0805                 2 22R          $0.01  $0.03 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CRGCQ0805J22R/A130124CT-ND/8577956/?itemSeq=297385638
16 RP2                        RPACK_1206             1 100K 1%      $0.08  $0.08 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CAT16-1003F4LF/CAT16-1003F4LFCT-ND/3592894/?itemSeq=297385959
17 RP1                        RPACK_1206             1 10K 5%       $0.01  $0.01 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/EXB-V8V103JV/Y4103CT-ND/155171/?itemSeq=297385997
18 X1                         HC49US                 1 16MHz        $0.60  $0.60 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ECS-160-20-3X-TR/XC1776CT-ND/2676640/?itemSeq=297386083
19 U3,U5,U4                   DHVQFN16               3 74AHC595     $0.60  $1.80 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/74AHC595BQ%2c115/1727-6021-1-ND/2753857/?itemSeq=297386118
I'd really like to convert this thing...but I dunno what to do here.

Oh not to mention not only is it not working, but the DAC101S101 (U2) is sparking/crackling


One other note: I'm testing the controller completely disconnected from my actual beamspring. Just plugging the converter alone into my computer. Don't know if that matters.

User avatar
darkcruix

15 Jul 2019, 09:31

As I am using the same parts as you are, I can give an update as soon as my PCBs have arrived.
Attaching the controller without keyboard attached should work without issues and I am worried about the sparking/crackling :)

This can be caused by shortening something, like the USB connector itself or other parts. The 0.1uF condensators shouldn't care about the polarity but I am not so sure about C5. As I am not an expert, I have only wild guesses here.

PancakeMSTR

15 Jul 2019, 16:09

Yeah I'm interested in the results you get. By the way I screwed up with the edge connector, it's too small. You need one with 3.96mm pitch

User avatar
darkcruix

15 Jul 2019, 19:47

I've ordered correct ones here in Germany. They have been relatively easy to obtain from here:
https://www.arcadiabay.de/steckerleisten.aspx

DMA

16 Jul 2019, 06:52

Why would you do that in 2019? CY8CKIT-059 is 5x cheaper and supports literally everything (except parts of macro engine which didn't strictly work anyway).

"USB device not recognized" is "it's powered on, but something strange comes off data pins". Check the signal train from USB socket to the main chip.

If things spark - you are definitely blowing the resettable fuse in your USB port. Not sure after how many cycles they become blown fuses, so you want to avoid plugging things that short-circuit USB power pins :)

PancakeMSTR

16 Jul 2019, 17:57

DMA wrote:
16 Jul 2019, 06:52
CY8CKIT-059


The what?

Is that the commonsense controller? I've sort of subscribed myself to the xwhatsit already, but if I can't get it to work I'll go with commonsense.

It doesn't help that there is no particularly clear guide for how to use the commonsense controller, or how to hook up the solenoid driver with it.

DMA

16 Jul 2019, 18:49

I'm all ears. What does it mean to have a "particularly clear guide"?

User avatar
Muirium
µ

16 Jul 2019, 18:54

It means understandable by curious but not-that-curious nincompoops, like the rest of us! So you spell out things really explicitly. Do not assume knowledge. Everything relevant should be laid out so clearly, it strikes you as insulting to the reader. It isn’t. We need that!

Oh, and everything that is not directly relevant to the reader's needs should be ruthlessly cut. It’s really all about giving us the direct how-to we need.

Xwhatsit’s docs were pretty good that way. I remember finding them a bit of a stretch in places but mostly reassuring.

PancakeMSTR

16 Jul 2019, 19:02

DMA wrote:
16 Jul 2019, 18:49
I'm all ears. What does it mean to have a "particularly clear guide"?


Something that answers the following questions:
  • This device supports many different keyboards, here's how you determine how to wire it up. E.g. this is how you determine rows and columns, logical way of wiring these pins to the microcontroller, etc. Example(s) provided.
  • Ok now you've wired it up, here's the steps you need to take to program it, outlined, start to finish. Starting from necessary software installation on applicable operating systems to programming individual keys. Example(s) provided.
Also what Muirium said.

That would be a good start.

DMA

16 Jul 2019, 19:37

So, second part is there. With keypresses even.

First part is also kind of there - it tells you about where rows and columns are by default. If you go remapping - you must understand the dev environment and I'm not making that readme "teach yourself PSoC Creator in 21 days".
Not convinced whether "how to figure out your PCB interface" should be in this README or not - if you're into esoteric hardware, you should know about those things.

The difference between xwhatsit docs and CS docs is that the former didn't have any choice/options. It was made for 4x23 or 8x16 matrix, and it was preprogrammed - which took care of switch type, too. So you had a physical board which defined _everything_. Simplifies instructions, but good luck if you have a displaywriter, because nobody makes xwhatsit for displaywriter as there are not many of those.

PancakeMSTR

16 Jul 2019, 19:45

DMA wrote:
16 Jul 2019, 19:37
if you're into esoteric hardware, you should know about those things.

Dude, no. That is an unacceptable attitude, and you are not going to be well liked if you carry on that way. The saying about making assumptions comes to mind.

You may be some great expert, and were sorry that we aren't as brilliant as you are, but we still want to convert out keyboards and still want help doing so and aren't really interested in being condescended towards in the process.

I strongly suggest you reassess your attitude on this matter.

DMA

16 Jul 2019, 20:53

I am not a "great expert", neither I play one on TV.
It's just I mostly know when I don't know things - and PCB mapping without PCB in hand is one of those.
I literally can't know all the variants (or even technologies) of all the keyboards CS _may_ support (see, for example, Sandgrax's foam-and-foil conversions).

PS: f you think xwhatsit manual is authoritative on the layout of IBM keyboards from 70s so everything must "just work" - well, it's the other way around.
_your_ 3278 may have different layout and different matrix - because it's of some rare batch or something.

PancakeMSTR

16 Jul 2019, 23:00

DMA wrote:
16 Jul 2019, 20:53
I am not a "great expert", neither I play one on TV.
It's just I mostly know when I don't know things - and PCB mapping without PCB in hand is one of those.
I literally can't know all the variants (or even technologies) of all the keyboards CS _may_ support (see, for example, Sandgrax's foam-and-foil conversions).

PS: f you think xwhatsit manual is authoritative on the layout of IBM keyboards from 70s so everything must "just work" - well, it's the other way around.
_your_ 3278 may have different layout and different matrix - because it's of some rare batch or something.
The point here is that if you were given a capacitive switch keyboard, you could probably make it work. Try to put the process that you would apply down in words so that others may learn from it.

I don't think xwhatsit's manual is authoritative, in fact he's lacking massively in particularly annoying ways, not to mention I can't even get mine to work (although that's probably down to bad soldering, but who knows, you know?)

DMA

16 Jul 2019, 23:58

PancakeMSTR wrote:
16 Jul 2019, 23:00
(although that's probably down to bad soldering, but who knows, you know?)
Oh, don't worry. If you pass the "solder it correctly" part - you'll just unlock level 2.
The boss on level 2 is "find a threshold which reliably registers keypresses and yet doesn't spuriously fire when I don't press anything". :)

As for "lacking in annoying ways" - I fail to see any publicly-accessible documents from you which would describe your findings and how you overcame those. You're blaming me for not providing you with pictured step by step guide - yet I don't see any produced by you. Do unto others, y'know.

User avatar
snacksthecat
✶✶✶✶

17 Jul 2019, 00:33

DMA wrote:
16 Jul 2019, 23:58
Oh, don't worry. If you pass the "solder it correctly" part - you'll just unlock level 2.
The boss on level 2 is "find a threshold which reliably registers keypresses and yet doesn't spuriously fire when I don't press anything". :)
Image

PancakeMSTR

17 Jul 2019, 00:40

DMA wrote:
16 Jul 2019, 23:58
PancakeMSTR wrote:
16 Jul 2019, 23:00
(although that's probably down to bad soldering, but who knows, you know?)
Oh, don't worry. If you pass the "solder it correctly" part - you'll just unlock level 2.
The boss on level 2 is "find a threshold which reliably registers keypresses and yet doesn't spuriously fire when I don't press anything". :)

As for "lacking in annoying ways" - I fail to see any publicly-accessible documents from you which would describe your findings and how you overcame those. You're blaming me for not providing you with pictured step by step guide - yet I don't see any produced by you. Do unto others, y'know.
Look, I get that the xwhatsit is apparently not the optimal solution, even though some people seem to be using it just fine. To me, it just seems like the easiest approach to converting a beamspring, while your method does not. That was what factored into my decision making process.

Nonetheless, I'm planning on trying to get both the xwhatsit and your commonsense converter working.

As for "documents describing my findings," I don't have any because I haven't successfully gotten either the xwhatsit or
the commonsense converters working, though I might write up my experience if I ever do. At a minimum, though, I at least put together a parts list for the xwhatsit beamspring-usb pcb, which I consider a start.
Last edited by PancakeMSTR on 17 Jul 2019, 00:44, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
snacksthecat
✶✶✶✶

17 Jul 2019, 00:43

PancakeMSTR wrote:
15 Jul 2019, 03:21
Spoiler:
Hi,
I just finished (badly, SMD sucks so hard) soldering up a Beamspring -USB-5251 Rev 4. When I plug it into my computer (win 10), it says "USB device not recognized) and when I try to start up the capsense utility it says "No Controller found"

Here's the parts list:

Code: Select all

                            Sheet 1: Beamspring-USB

Id Designator                 Package         Quantity Designation Price  Total
 1 CON1                       USB_MINI_B             1 USB-MINI-B   $1.42  $1.42 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/690-005-299-043/151-1206-1-ND/4312192/?itemSeq=297384381
 2 U2                         tsot-6                 1 DAC101S101   $3.16  $3.16 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/DAC101S101CIMK%2fNOPB/DAC101S101CIMK%2fNOPBCT-ND/953475/?itemSeq=297384429
 3 U1                         TQFP32                 1 ATMEGA32U2   $7.00  $7.00 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ATMEGA32U2-AUR/ATMEGA32U2-AURCT-ND/3789462/?itemSeq=297384636
 6 U6                         so-14                  1 LM339A       $0.48  $0.48 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/LM339ADT/497-1586-1-ND/592080/?itemSeq=297384826
 7 C3,C4                      SM0805                 2 22pF         $0.01  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/C0805C220J5GACTU/399-1113-1-ND/411388/?itemSeq=297385114
 8 C10,C9,C8,C11,C6,C7,C2,C12 SM0805                 8 0.1uF        $0.01  $0.08 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL21F104ZBCNNNC/1276-1007-1-ND/3889093/?itemSeq=297385195
 9 R4                         SM0805                 1 4.7K         $0.01  $0.01 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/RC0805JR-074K7L/311-4.7KARCT-ND/731274/?itemSeq=297385269
10 R3,R17                     SM0805                 2 20K          $0.01  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ERA-6AEB203V/P20KDACT-ND/1465978/?itemSeq=297385292
11 R1,R16,R2                  SM0805                 3 10K          $0.01  $0.03 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/RNCF0805DTE10K0/RNCF0805DTE10K0CT-ND/2687083/?itemSeq=297385332
12 C1                         SM0805                 1 1uF          $0.02  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL21B105KAFNNNE/1276-1066-1-ND/3889152/?itemSeq=297385348
13 R15                        SM0805                 1 47K          $0.01  $0.01 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ERA-6AEB473V/P47KDACT-ND/1465987/?itemSeq=297385373
14 C5                         SM0805                 1 4.7uF        $0.02  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL21A475KOFNNNE/1276-1065-1-ND/3889151/?itemSeq=297385412
15 R6,R5                      SM0805                 2 22R          $0.01  $0.03 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CRGCQ0805J22R/A130124CT-ND/8577956/?itemSeq=297385638
16 RP2                        RPACK_1206             1 100K 1%      $0.08  $0.08 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CAT16-1003F4LF/CAT16-1003F4LFCT-ND/3592894/?itemSeq=297385959
17 RP1                        RPACK_1206             1 10K 5%       $0.01  $0.01 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/EXB-V8V103JV/Y4103CT-ND/155171/?itemSeq=297385997
18 X1                         HC49US                 1 16MHz        $0.60  $0.60 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ECS-160-20-3X-TR/XC1776CT-ND/2676640/?itemSeq=297386083
19 U3,U5,U4                   DHVQFN16               3 74AHC595     $0.60  $1.80 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/74AHC595BQ%2c115/1727-6021-1-ND/2753857/?itemSeq=297386118
I'd really like to convert this thing...but I dunno what to do here.

Oh not to mention not only is it not working, but the DAC101S101 (U2) is sparking/crackling


One other note: I'm testing the controller completely disconnected from my actual beamspring. Just plugging the converter alone into my computer. Don't know if that matters.
It's almost certainly the soldering. I too am bad at SMD soldering but practice makes perfect. Maybe try to take a few photos, especially of the MCU. It might be something that can be reworked.

When you plug it into the computer for the first time, it should show up as "Atmel USB Device" > "ATmega32U4" if I'm not mistaken.

I'm sorry I'm not very familiar with xwhatsit but it sounds like you want to validate:
  • You used the right components
  • Your soldering is fine
There's certainly people here who can help answer those questions.

Oh and my guess is that, if parts were sparking, those parts (and possibly others) may be toast. This is just a guess though. Unfortunately a fried component doesn't always show visible signs of brokenness.

PancakeMSTR

17 Jul 2019, 00:46

snacksthecat wrote:
17 Jul 2019, 00:43
PancakeMSTR wrote:
15 Jul 2019, 03:21
Spoiler:
Hi,
I just finished (badly, SMD sucks so hard) soldering up a Beamspring -USB-5251 Rev 4. When I plug it into my computer (win 10), it says "USB device not recognized) and when I try to start up the capsense utility it says "No Controller found"

Here's the parts list:

Code: Select all

                            Sheet 1: Beamspring-USB

Id Designator                 Package         Quantity Designation Price  Total
 1 CON1                       USB_MINI_B             1 USB-MINI-B   $1.42  $1.42 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/690-005-299-043/151-1206-1-ND/4312192/?itemSeq=297384381
 2 U2                         tsot-6                 1 DAC101S101   $3.16  $3.16 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/DAC101S101CIMK%2fNOPB/DAC101S101CIMK%2fNOPBCT-ND/953475/?itemSeq=297384429
 3 U1                         TQFP32                 1 ATMEGA32U2   $7.00  $7.00 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ATMEGA32U2-AUR/ATMEGA32U2-AURCT-ND/3789462/?itemSeq=297384636
 6 U6                         so-14                  1 LM339A       $0.48  $0.48 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/LM339ADT/497-1586-1-ND/592080/?itemSeq=297384826
 7 C3,C4                      SM0805                 2 22pF         $0.01  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/C0805C220J5GACTU/399-1113-1-ND/411388/?itemSeq=297385114
 8 C10,C9,C8,C11,C6,C7,C2,C12 SM0805                 8 0.1uF        $0.01  $0.08 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL21F104ZBCNNNC/1276-1007-1-ND/3889093/?itemSeq=297385195
 9 R4                         SM0805                 1 4.7K         $0.01  $0.01 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/RC0805JR-074K7L/311-4.7KARCT-ND/731274/?itemSeq=297385269
10 R3,R17                     SM0805                 2 20K          $0.01  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ERA-6AEB203V/P20KDACT-ND/1465978/?itemSeq=297385292
11 R1,R16,R2                  SM0805                 3 10K          $0.01  $0.03 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/RNCF0805DTE10K0/RNCF0805DTE10K0CT-ND/2687083/?itemSeq=297385332
12 C1                         SM0805                 1 1uF          $0.02  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL21B105KAFNNNE/1276-1066-1-ND/3889152/?itemSeq=297385348
13 R15                        SM0805                 1 47K          $0.01  $0.01 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ERA-6AEB473V/P47KDACT-ND/1465987/?itemSeq=297385373
14 C5                         SM0805                 1 4.7uF        $0.02  $0.02 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CL21A475KOFNNNE/1276-1065-1-ND/3889151/?itemSeq=297385412
15 R6,R5                      SM0805                 2 22R          $0.01  $0.03 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CRGCQ0805J22R/A130124CT-ND/8577956/?itemSeq=297385638
16 RP2                        RPACK_1206             1 100K 1%      $0.08  $0.08 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/CAT16-1003F4LF/CAT16-1003F4LFCT-ND/3592894/?itemSeq=297385959
17 RP1                        RPACK_1206             1 10K 5%       $0.01  $0.01 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/EXB-V8V103JV/Y4103CT-ND/155171/?itemSeq=297385997
18 X1                         HC49US                 1 16MHz        $0.60  $0.60 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ECS-160-20-3X-TR/XC1776CT-ND/2676640/?itemSeq=297386083
19 U3,U5,U4                   DHVQFN16               3 74AHC595     $0.60  $1.80 : https://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/74AHC595BQ%2c115/1727-6021-1-ND/2753857/?itemSeq=297386118
I'd really like to convert this thing...but I dunno what to do here.

Oh not to mention not only is it not working, but the DAC101S101 (U2) is sparking/crackling


One other note: I'm testing the controller completely disconnected from my actual beamspring. Just plugging the converter alone into my computer. Don't know if that matters.
It's almost certainly the soldering. I too am bad at SMD soldering but practice makes perfect. Maybe try to take a few photos, especially of the MCU. It might be something that can be reworked.

When you plug it into the computer for the first time, it should show up as "Atmel USB Device" > "ATmega32U4" if I'm not mistaken.

I'm sorry I'm not very familiar with xwhatsit but it sounds like you want to validate:
  • You used the right components
  • Your soldering is fine
There's certainly people here who can help answer those questions.

Oh and my guess is that, if parts were sparking, those parts (and possibly others) may be toast. This is just a guess though. Unfortunately a fried component doesn't always show visible signs of brokenness.
Yeah I probably screwed something up with the soldering. I've ordered parts to try again, and also am planning on ordering parts to try one of Commonsense's converters. I'll come back here with the results, but it'll prolly be a week or two.

Oh and the major thing I want to validate is that I have the right parts, I know my soldering is terrible and probably the reason I fried parts. I'll only start to reconsider that if I feel like I soldered everything absolutely perfectly and it's still not working.

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