deskthority

This is my first post to the forums but I have been lurking for months now reading the wiki and past posts. I'm working on a project, I won't get into details until its more complete but I was hoping someone had information on the types of plastic used in Alps switches? I know they changed sliders to Nylon(POM) but what was the original material? Also were the top and bottom casing made of ABS ,or something else? In your opinions how much of an affect on sound and feel did the change create. Thank you for any help you can provide.

Well, I know nothing but this seems a smart endeavour. I would have guessed all modular keyswitches are made of ABS as it’s the best behaved and most easily worked with plastic. No need to worry about discolouring too. (Not that manufacturers much bothered even with pale ABS caps!) but you already know more about this than I do. What’s your source for Alps purported move?

I darent even check the wiki for fear of the Alps Vortex’s infamous depth and current!

I don't know what plastic they used, but Nylon != POM. Nylon is a family of synthetic polymers while POM (aka acetal or Delrin) is a specific polymer. POM is a denser material.

I have just done an acetone test on a ALPS housing for you and they do melt so they MAY be ABS. They dont break like ABS tho, and they dont go white from stress and this is very common for dark ABS, this however may be due to age ?

Take this as you will hope it helps.

I would take a look at drylin from igus if your thinking of making new sliders.

IIRC Alps housings are Nylon (same as Cherry) and sliders are POM.

Is there any source for the claim Cherry uses Nylon for their switch hosings?

I was wondering about that myself a while ago and only found a thread on GH discussing that with the conclusion that pretty much all switch manufacturers use POM for their housings.

But no one really had any source ...

Chyros wrote: IIRC Alps housings are Nylon (same as Cherry) and sliders are POM.

Does nylon melt in acetone then ?

andrewjoy wrote:

Chyros wrote: IIRC Alps housings are Nylon (same as Cherry) and sliders are POM.

Does nylon melt in acetone then ?

Off the top of my head, no. Although there are various types of Nylon. I know Cherry uses Nylon 6,6; don't know if Alps used the same.

Chyros wrote: ... I know Cherry uses Nylon 6,6 ...

ANY source?

They actually do advertise using a "plastic polymer" for the housings:
http://cherryamericas.com/cherry-mx-board-silent/

But Nylon 6,6 sounds like there is some spec out there I have missed so far

Chyros wrote:

andrewjoy wrote:

Chyros wrote: IIRC Alps housings are Nylon (same as Cherry) and sliders are POM.

Does nylon melt in acetone then ?

Off the top of my head, no. Although there are various types of Nylon. I know Cherry uses Nylon 6,6; don't know if Alps used the same.

Not sure they are nylon then as at least mine DO melt under acetone

Another test to try is the melt temperature test.
I follow AvE on youtube and he sometimes does this: with a temp controlled soldering iron he melts some plastics (housing of power tools mostly) and based on the temperature he sometimes guesses the plastic type involved.

It helps to have some samples of known plastic materials on hand to check they melt at the same temperature. Or tables of melting points listings.

Thank you guys for the quick replies. I was trying to do this without destroying to many switches, but I will melt test a few and then melt some known plastics of equal mass. I just wonder how much of an effect the plastic type has on sound and feel. Obviously it does have an effect, I just am going to need to do alot more testing to see how much. But hey that's the fun part. Thanks again.

Correction, I misremembered; according to a former Alps employee;

"the white switch stem Probably nylon moulded and ABS for the switch body"

Wodan wrote:

Chyros wrote: ... I know Cherry uses Nylon 6,6 ...

ANY source?

NovelKeys; "Only stems are made of POM. Housing is typically PC or PA66 Nylon". (PC is for the clear ones)

Hm okay that‘s not really the kind of source I was hoping for, that‘s a competitors claim. But I guess we have different standards for „knowing“ things.

Wodan wrote: Hm okay that‘s not really the kind of source I was hoping for, that‘s a competitors claim. But I guess we have different standards for „knowing“ things.

You're right, it's much easier to not try to find out anything at all, leave everyone else to do the work for you, and then just criticise them for it.

If Cherry housings are indeed POM, this would be very interesting news to certain manufacturers indeed, let me put it that way.

Oh yeah, by the way, Steve also confirmed that the Alps housing is ABS. But of course he's also a competitor, so there's no way he could be right. So it's probably Nylon after all.

I have done some investigation on my own and came to no conclusion, only finding vague assumptions and claims with missing sources.

I admire your efforts of picking up a vague statement made by NovelKeys and turning it into something you know for a fact. Solid reasearch here, hat tipping intensifies.

Ps: I would also be surprised if it‘s something other than Nylon, not even disputing that assumption.

Wodan wrote: I have done some investigation on my own and came to no conclusion, only finding vague assumptions and claims with missing sources.

I admire your efforts of picking up a vague statement made by NovelKeys and turning it into something you know for a fact. Solid reasearch here, hat tipping intensifies.

Ps: I would also be surprised if it‘s something other than Nylon, not even disputing that assumption.

Glad you're expressing your agreement by insulting people and goading them into arguments. You're right, surely the best thing to do when you don't dispute someone's assumption and have absolutely no proof or even indication to the contrary is to tell them they know nothing and that their sources are non-credible.

Of course you could've asked someone who actually works in the industry yourself and gotten some actual sources. Oh wait, of course, they aren't actually sources. Well, hopefully you'll one day be able to afford a TGA and a DSC and finally figure it out. In the meantime, shall we just name the mystery substance from another planet, "Nylon"?

You really remind me of someone who used to be on this forum. He was also a fantastic hypocrite who loved the smell of his own farts and attacked people for no reason. He's now gone, but I'm sure you've had many dealings. Almost as if you carbon copied his attitude, in fact. You must really look up to him.

Chyros wrote:
You really remind me of someone who used to be on this forum. He was also a fantastic hypocrite who loved the smell of his own farts and attacked people for no reason.

I think that Thomas has had a couple of beers tonight.

If someone has available switches to sacrifice, there are some fun ways.. http://www.modernplastics.com/wp-conten ... astics.pdf ... to find out what plastics they use.

Chalba wrote: If someone has available switches to sacrifice, there are some fun ways.. http://www.modernplastics.com/wp-conten ... astics.pdf ... to find out what plastics they use.

yeah, smelling burning plastic is not what I'd call fun...

It reminds me of Adam Savage's quote: "Remember kids, the only difference between screwing around and science is writing it down"