deskthority

So I've been watching a LOT of Chyrosran and after watching his video on the Smith-Corona leaf twat a couple of times I started to wonder something. How can one make this any worse? And then that led me to this question. Is their a way to make the worst keyboard switch imaginable. Like an ultra scratchy, stiff, rattily, annoying monstrosity of a switch that sounds like nails on a chalkboard if that chalkboard was also sentient and screaming in pain.

You have to make the key switch weighting uneven and have a terrible keyboard controller as well.

Daniel Beardsmore wrote: 12 Feb 2017, 00:46 That is quite possibly the worst keyboard I've ever had (the one you see on the wiki). Even if you forgive the messed up key weighting and keys getting stuck, you literally cannot touch type on it. Fast typing causes it to send gibberish — either ghosts or misordered keystrokes (I forget which). The controller is absolute garbage and only suits hunt and peck. So much for the "professional Manufacturer of Enhance Keyboard"!

viewtopic.php?t=15863&sid=a66f64c99c83d ... bb0d2c9492

Make it clicky but have the click and tactile feedback all over the place: not at the same place, different for each switch and different depending on how hard/fast you press.

Super-mushy landing with actuation at the very bottom, after you have pressed it down into the metal plastic with extra force.

Not just scratchy: You must press exactly in the centre for it to work.
Oh, and no stabilisers: hat-caps or second slider that is also scratchy -- so you'd have to press not necessarily in the centre, but at a particular point on the key that is not where you expect it to be.

Make the switch a Sisyphean endeavor to activate so instead of thinking about actuating the switch we focus on the friends we made along the way.

Sadly, Matias have had a good shot at it and ruined their reputation in the process...

Chyros had a really shit SCLS module. I had one and it was extremely smooth with zero binding. The keyfeel was weird, but not bad. People need to stop taking his word as gospel.

Keybug wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 14:21 Sadly, Matias have had a good shot at it and ruined their reputation in the process...

Wym? What Matias switch are you talking about?

IMO, rusted out, scratchy as hell, and mushier than a burnt marshmallow on the bottom out. that'd do it.

sand, that's all I have to say xD, but in more seriousness, I and my friends used to try to make the scratchiest speed cube (Rubik's cube but better), but you can do things with those that you can't exactly do with a switch because it doesn't have electrical components, like putting peanut butter or slime in the cube. but here are some things that you can do, replace the springs with weightings that nobody could get behind, even if they are the most staunched defender of heavy springs. also, you can massively over lube and make the key feel suuuuper sluggish, and with a really thick lube like 205g0. or maybe experiment with different liquids that don't actually lube like toothpaste or something. also rust, to do this just put the metal components in water and wait 4-5 days for rust to form. my last suggestion is to put it in a drop.com made keyboard xD

TNT wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 14:55

Keybug wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 14:21 Sadly, Matias have had a good shot at it and ruined their reputation in the process...

Wym? What Matias switch are you talking about?

I'm talking about any "mechanical" Matias switch. They've thus ruined one of the most promising (at least when it was first released) split mechanical keyboards, for example. I also quite liked their Mini keyboards, but alas they all chatter. Now I reckon they're only really still in business with non-mechanical Apple clone keyboards.

kelvinhall05 wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 14:35 Chyros had a really shit SCLS module. I had one and it was extremely smooth with zero binding. The keyfeel was weird, but not bad. People need to stop taking his word as gospel.

you honestly can't blame him, we have all had experiences of people overhyping a keyboard or switch and then trying it out for ourselves and it being lackluster, like any cherry switch produced in the 21st century, novelkeys cream (which aren't necessarily bad its just a lot of lubes seem to make the stick-slip worse), like really any zeal switch, any smk 2nd gen switch that isn't clicky, and many others.
the only thing that I can really get behind is that he is very biased and is just often wrong, (not talking about the wrong opinion because they are, yknow, opinions) and often doesn't do his research on modern switches specifically. I also can't really blame him for that as they are not his main focus. I don't think anyone has ever bought or not bought a modern switch in particular because chyros said that it is bad xD. as someone that likes vintage for the clicky, and modern for the linear, I almost agree with basically everything that he says tho, so I am just a bit biased. but I can recognize his blatant disregard for lots of new aspects, as I am both in the modern geekhack r/mk type community, and also the vintage deskthority type community. he makes so many assumptions it's not even funny.

Keybug wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 17:13

TNT wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 14:55

Keybug wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 14:21 Sadly, Matias have had a good shot at it and ruined their reputation in the process...

Wym? What Matias switch are you talking about?

I'm talking about any "mechanical" Matias switch. They've thus ruined one of the most promising (at least when it was first released) split mechanical keyboards, for example. I also quite liked their Mini keyboards, but alas they all chatter. Now I reckon they're only really still in business with non-mechanical Apple clone keyboards.

They did come out with a slight revision to their design that doesn't fail every other day. I also think they're pretty great to type on.

I think Chyros has a point that the worst "switches" are from the projection keyboard he had. That's a design that genuinely causes pain.

My point wasn't typing feel at all, but that amazing error rate given a modern-day switch.

Keybug wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 18:51 My point wasn't typing feel at all, but that amazing error rate given a modern-day switch.

Yes, and I acknowledge that. I own one of those keyboards. The latest version of the quiet tactile switch from Matias hasn't (so far) been a problem for me.

Findecanor wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 10:52 Make it clicky but have the click and tactile feedback all over the place: not at the same place, different for each switch and different depending on how hard/fast you press.

Super-mushy landing with actuation at the very bottom, after you have pressed it down into the metal plastic with extra force.

Not just scratchy: You must press exactly in the centre for it to work.
Oh, and no stabilisers: hat-caps or second slider that is also scratchy -- so you'd have to press not necessarily in the centre, but at a particular point on the key that is not where you expect it to be.

Just imagining this keyboard made me die inside. I love it

ddrfraser1 wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 16:19 IMO, rusted out, scratchy as hell, and mushier than a burnt marshmallow on the bottom out. that'd do it.

For added awfulness make it only use the keycaps that come with it. The keycaps just so happen to be thinner than shattered ice and for them to be so ugly it makes the Razer Blackwidow keycaps seem like a renaissance painting in comparison.

hellothere wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 18:38

Keybug wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 17:13

TNT wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 14:55

Wym? What Matias switch are you talking about?

I'm talking about any "mechanical" Matias switch. They've thus ruined one of the most promising (at least when it was first released) split mechanical keyboards, for example. I also quite liked their Mini keyboards, but alas they all chatter. Now I reckon they're only really still in business with non-mechanical Apple clone keyboards.

They did come out with a slight revision to their design that doesn't fail every other day. I also think they're pretty great to type on.

I'm confused, I thought that g.e. Matias click switches were quite good and a decent replacement for worn out white alps?

Ilostmytoeinvietnam wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 16:57 sand, that's all I have to say xD, but in more seriousness, I and my friends used to try to make the scratchiest speed cube (Rubik's cube but better), but you can do things with those that you can't exactly do with a switch because it doesn't have electrical components, like putting peanut butter or slime in the cube. but here are some things that you can do, replace the springs with weightings that nobody could get behind, even if they are the most staunched defender of heavy springs. also, you can massively over lube and make the key feel suuuuper sluggish, and with a really thick lube like 205g0. or maybe experiment with different liquids that don't actually lube like toothpaste or something. also rust, to do this just put the metal components in water and wait 4-5 days for rust to form. my last suggestion is to put it in a drop.com made keyboard xD

So your telling me that lubing a keyboard with toothpaste is bad? Explains a lot.

Easiest way to do it it so fill the keyboard with nothing but latching switches.

Kneeboard wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 20:13

Ilostmytoeinvietnam wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 16:57 sand, that's all I have to say xD, but in more seriousness, I and my friends used to try to make the scratchiest speed cube (Rubik's cube but better), but you can do things with those that you can't exactly do with a switch because it doesn't have electrical components, like putting peanut butter or slime in the cube. but here are some things that you can do, replace the springs with weightings that nobody could get behind, even if they are the most staunched defender of heavy springs. also, you can massively over lube and make the key feel suuuuper sluggish, and with a really thick lube like 205g0. or maybe experiment with different liquids that don't actually lube like toothpaste or something. also rust, to do this just put the metal components in water and wait 4-5 days for rust to form. my last suggestion is to put it in a drop.com made keyboard xD

So your telling me that lubing a keyboard with toothpaste is bad? Explains a lot.

xD it is????

TNT wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 20:08

hellothere wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 18:38

Keybug wrote: 30 Nov 2020, 17:13 I'm talking about any "mechanical" Matias switch. They've thus ruined one of the most promising (at least when it was first released) split mechanical keyboards, for example. I also quite liked their Mini keyboards, but alas they all chatter. Now I reckon they're only really still in business with non-mechanical Apple clone keyboards.

They did come out with a slight revision to their design that doesn't fail every other day. I also think they're pretty great to type on.

I'm confused, I thought that g.e. Matias click switches were quite good and a decent replacement for worn out white alps?

Matias has four switches: the one they put into their slim-line Mac compatible keyboards, a clicky switch ("an authentic re-creation of the classic clicky ALPS switch"), the quiet click switch (Matias' answer to Alps cream damped switches), and a linear switch (they don't really compare it a specific Alps switch, but let's just say yellow Alps). Note that the "Alps replacement" switches are closer to 4 tab Alps clones, as their components don't look very Alps-y.

The only Matias switch that I have experience with is the Quiet Click, which was the one put in their ergo keyboards. They had a reputation for lots of key chatter. Matias did change the switch design two+ years ago to fix this. The replacement switches I bought from Matias haven't failed me.

I'm not a touch typist, so most ergo keyboards are lost on me. In the case of those "original Matias" ergo boards, though, you could put both halves together to create a really nice keyboard for a four-fingered typist. However, I'm typing this on a keyboard with cream damped Alps and these switches are unquestionably better on the feel side. Hmmm. Matias ergo with cream damped Alps switches. I could make that happen.

Alright, thanks for clearing that up. I didn't know Matias had a problem with key chatter and heard everywhere they were reliable ancestors of simplified alps. Their linears and the scissor switches excluded lol

When I aquire a 3D printer, I want to toy with making some MX style switches. One design I was thinking of would have a metal strip that would slide at an angle against another metal strip to complete the circuit. This would cause the edge of the first strip to make a nasty noise, I'm hoping for something like brake wear indicators or nails on a chalkboard, while being extremely scratchy.

AgentOrange96 wrote: 04 Dec 2020, 08:08 When I aquire a 3D printer, I want to toy with making some MX style switches. One design I was thinking of would have a metal strip that would slide at an angle against another metal strip to complete the circuit. This would cause the edge of the first strip to make a nasty noise, I'm hoping for something like brake wear indicators or nails on a chalkboard, while being extremely scratchy.

You gotta make it bind a ton as well

I'm not sure what it was, but I think it could have been a variation of Siemens STB that had a weird sensation when pressing.
It was scratchy on the way down in a way that resembled getting shocked with electricity, as when touching an electric appliance that isn't plugged into an earthed socket. Disconcerting feeling.

Findecanor wrote: 04 Dec 2020, 13:19 I'm not sure what it was, but I think it could have been a variation of Siemens STB that had a weird sensation when pressing.
It was scratchy on the way down in a way that resembled getting shocked with electricity, as when touching an electric appliance that isn't plugged into an earthed socket. Disconcerting feeling.

To top this I shall be kickstarting a keyboard that explodes when you type on it. The early bird package is 900 pounds

Easy task:

Kneeboard wrote: 04 Dec 2020, 09:22
You gotta make it bind a ton as well

Lots of slop outta do it!

Findecanor wrote: 04 Dec 2020, 13:19 I'm not sure what it was, but I think it could have been a variation of Siemens STB that had a weird sensation when pressing.
It was scratchy on the way down in a way that resembled getting shocked with electricity, as when touching an electric appliance that isn't plugged into an earthed socket. Disconcerting feeling.

Hmm now I'm thinking piezo switches could be fun. A couple metal strips on each keycap for a tactile feel and perhaps some kind of sense coil and resistor to detect a key press.