deskthority

I know, I know, the vast majority of mobile keyboards are utter garbage... but seriously, that seems like it's even more of a reason to talk about them.

So, smartphone makers have gone away from having keyboards on their phones (except for a couple of BlackBerry models), and most of those keyboards were mediocre, using overly stiff metal domes, keycaps spaced too closely (and sometimes too flat as well), often poorly thought-out layouts, and just not being good to type on. BlackBerry does well for what they've got, but it's still not ideal, the keycaps are still too closely spaced to comfortably type on, and the layout HAS to be extremely condensed.

That leaves bluetooth keyboards, and the situation there is... well... shit. It's so shit that people hoard decade-old scissor-stabilized boards! (No, really, have you looked at the price of a Stowaway (40% layout) lately? (Although, the Dell-branded ones seem to be cheaper.) And I don't even see any Stowaway Sierras (the older 65%) on eBay.)

Given what the community has done regarding building the Western market for mechanical desktop keyboards, including some crazy niche things, I'm honestly surprised that something good for mobile hasn't been done. It's not like suitable technology for a good mobile keyboard doesn't exist today - metal dome can actually provide quite a bit of tactility without excessive noise, and I'm using a metal dome board with hinged keycaps (a subtle thing that HP does on their calculator keyboards to add a bit more travel) to write this post (on an HP 200LX, to be specific). The layout is pretty bad, and it's a bit wide to use as a thumb board due to the numpad on the right side, but the key spacing is excellent for a thumb board, key force isn't excessive, and really, this could be done today.

For reference, here's what a 200LX looks like for those who aren't familiar, and it's worth noting that other than thickness and weight, it's about the size of a modern phablet:



Also, the (wider) 300LX family (which ran Windows CE instead of MS-DOS 5.0) used a more conventional 60% layout (there's a couple differences, but it's not far off), with larger keys, I'm thinking of getting one just to compare the typing experiences (even though a Windows CE HPC is fairly useless, especially a 300LX or 320LX with CE 1.0, and the 320LX CE 2.0 upgrade is hard to find).



Really, why is every bluetooth pocketable keyboard at best a mediocre scissor-stabilized rubber dome board, and if they even have metal domes, they're excessively stiff and quickly fatiguing? Why can nobody make a good layout on such a keyboard? Why can't we, the community, make such a keyboard, for that matter? (I know, I know, tooling costs. But still...) I'd be quite happy with something like, say, a version of the 200LX keyboard that follows a 60% layout instead of HP's insane layout, as a thumb board.

Mobile devices have always had shite keyboards, going all the way back to the grand-daddy of them all (1975 Pulsar calculator watch):



I bought an organizer back the early 90's and I thought I'd get lots of use out of it - but the keyboard was such a pile of crap that I hardly used it. Because of that experience, I had no desire to ever get an organizer again.

What I really can't stand these days are keyboards that are designed to be used by the thumbs. I will never ever type with my thumbs.

I have been spoiled by good keyboards. Now I want a mobile phone with a buckling spring keypad and a beam spring remote control for the TV. (my remote was actually made by ALPS, but it's rubber dome)

The Psion Revo had hinged keycaps, which I never quite got used to, as I would keep pressing them near the top, where they hinged. Something I've always wondered is whether you could have a better keyboard in something that small; in all honesty a capacitive keyboard (just a silk-screened drawing of one over a capacitive touch panel) would have been better than the physical keyboard it used, as it was that painful to use. There were several things I wanted to see changed with the Revo, with the keyboard being one of them. Sadly, nothing like that will ever be made again.

I used to think that the keyboard on the Psion 5 was superb, but I've got two (a 5 and a 5mx) and the keyboard on both sucks: they're prone to missing and doubling-up letters. How much of that is due to rubber degradation, I don't know, as the 5mx is now around 15 years old. The keys on the 5mx are also a bit stiff, but that might also be the age; the touchscreen membrane is also far too stiff.

It would be interesting to see what the 5mx and Revo Plus would be like if they were recreated with modern technology, but kept as true as possible to their original ideals. I imagine that someone could do a far better job with the keyboards; whether they'd remain microkernel, though, I don't know.

HP's hinged keys are always bottom-hinged, not top-hinged. And, the keycap is shaped to direct the key force forward, too.

An older implementation (not the original, the original used higher profile keys that didn't direct key force as far forward):


The newer keycap profile (that the 200LX uses a variant of):


Everything modern uses one of those two profiles (depending on whether it's trying to be (or, in the case of the 12C, actually is) retro or not).

I hate the buttons on pretty much every calculator I’ve ever tried

For something pocketable, have you considered a chording keyboard? For example, the Twiddler.

Seldom do I find myself in the mainstream majority, so it's always a bit alarming when I do. But thumb keyboards always used to put me off as some voodoo CrackBerry skill, and I never learned one. Instead, capacitative touchscreens were the aha moment of discovery. "Well bugger a badger, this thing really works!" Same wound up being true of the mainstream, too. I two thumb type quicker than I ever pecked at a calculator or the like, and most everyone's up to it. For something that takes up zero space and mass, and is variable to suit the software, touchscreen keyboards are hard to beat. So the whole industry moved to them, bar the dying stragglers.

Chording keyboards are a nice idea, but require a great investment to learn. I can't be arsed. Many of us here can't either. That says a fair bit for their chances!

The small boards I like are all too much too large to be pocketable. They sit on my knees or at the desk. For going mobile, the odds are truly stacked against you.

Chording keyboards really are a very unnatural thing to use to type with, and there's a reason they only ever become a niche thing.

I can't thumb type on a touchscreen at all (and mind you, I've had two BlackBerries for work, and a Palm Centro personally, so I can definitely thumb type, although thumb typing on keyboards like that is just too small), but I can Swype. It's just not ideal.

bhtooefr wrote: Chording keyboards really are a very unnatural thing to use to type with, and there's a reason they only ever become a niche thing.

All typing is very unnatural. As is writing, or speaking, or solving arithmetic problems, or playing a violin, or playing tennis, or riding a bike, or driving, or...

Chording keyboards have a steeper learning curve than current touchscreen or blackberry-style phone keyboards, but a well designed one should be ultimately substantially more efficient.

Current phone keyboards are ideal for typing a few words at a time, while giving full focus (using both hands and looking down at the device). As soon as you want to look at something else at the same time, or type more than a couple sentences, a chording keyboard has a big advantage. Of course, usually when you want to do anything with efficiency, your best bet is to put the phone down and open up a real computer.

Yup. Chording keyboards are in an awkward spot between the convenience of (slow) touchscreens and the power of (bulky) desktop keyboards. But require more effort to learn than both.

The thing about the chording keyboards is that they devote a whole-hand stroke to a single letter. Though this is superior for actual touch typing, where you aren't looking, it is slow in the extreme. Stenography gets around this at the price of considerable learning curve to type at all.

These considerations are part of why I don't talk about pocketable keyboards. Though I do have one of those Dell-branded Bluetooth 40% ones, and I really like it a lot for use with my phone on the go.

Hmmm, I was told about one new development for my gesture-based Jolla phone: a slide-out keyboard with 60% layout and nav-pad.

It looks somewhat interesting, but I'm afraid that it's just going to be rubber dome or some other membrane-based technology. It will have to be seen if it turns out to be a hinged metal spring design, but it seems unlikely.

I loved the keyboards on my HP 48s back in the day. I have a modern retro 35S where the keys are not too bad. Also from what I remember the original Sidekick was a joy to type on, and the Blackberry Passport keyboard is quite good aside from the fact that there is no grip to hold the thing. It's a little awkward, but does the job and the capacitive bars between key rows are pretty neat and useful, if sometimes over sensitive.

The Palm Pixi had an excellent keyboard-- Blackberry like, pretty tactile, keys pretty discrete.

I only had mine for a few days before the speaker blew out and I decided to get the "higher spec" Pre, which had an inferior keyboard (sunken inside the slide-apart chassis, much flatter).

One of the best phone keyboards, if you can call it a keyboard, for typing without looking was the Nokia 3210..I could write an SMS in seconds without a peek of the screen! Without the T-9 crap!

I'm another fan of the 3210! I mainly used it for snake though, but the keyboard was great for that as well