IBM Model M (SSK) - How many broken rivets until bolt-mod?

hammelgammler · 06 May 2015, 22:32

Hey,

i just received a few SSK's from Cindy, kind of quick from America to Germany.

Just a quick question, after how many broken rivets you should do a bolt-mod?...

There are three SSK's, one has 9 broken rivets, another one 11 + a damaged spring, and the last one 7 + 1 spring felt off from the hammer.
On all of them a few keys doesn't clicked, a few stucked when pressed down and from one ESC key the spring is damaged.

I could steal some springs/hammers from my full-size Model M, which would then also need a bolt-mod and two springs to work again...

Any advices?

That are my first Model M's which going to be restored.

Best regards,
David

chzel · 06 May 2015, 22:45

My SSK is up to 27 broken rivets and yet it works perfectly!
Regarding the ones that don't click, remove the cap, tilt the board back, and reinsert. Sometimes they just need re-seating.

Muirium · 06 May 2015, 22:50

All depends on feel. You've got several Model Ms to compare between there: which ones feel best, and where?

Bolt mods are a lot of trouble. Well, the one I tried was! Other people swear by them, though. Also: springs can be replaced by the chopstick trick. (Anyone got a video?) Even stab supports can be pulled with a similar technique:

Chzel's quite right about non-clicking springs. Try re-seating, from different angles. If you see a bent spring: replace it.

Redmaus · 06 May 2015, 23:59

I like that method of taking the stabilizer insert out. I have done it a couple of times with a flat head screwdriver and caused some dents on the outside edge of the barrel

hammelgammler · 07 May 2015, 15:34

Thank you for your answers.

Unfortunately many keys on all SSKs feel a bit sandy like...
My full size Model M in comparison is butter smooth though.

Also I tried the spring swap with the chopstick method and it seems I'm too bad for this...
Either the key don't click after a swap, feels soo bad, or stucks...

To the bolt-mod, I know it's time consuming, but that's no problem, it would be more important how hard it is...

There's a raw bolt-mod or a nut-and-bolt-mod.
Am I right that with nuts the drilled holes doesn't have to be extremely perfect?
So it would be like: drill holes, put screw through holes, put everything together, put a metal washer on the screws, tighten everything with nuts.

Thanks!

Chyros · 07 May 2015, 16:26

It also depends where the broken rivets are. If they're all very grouped, it's much more serious.

vivalarevolución · 07 May 2015, 16:46

I bolt mod every Model M that comes my way because every rivet will break eventually. And somebody has to do it. But that's just me. Plus, they feel much better with a bolt mod.

idollar · 07 May 2015, 17:44

prdlm2009 wrote: ↑I bolt mod every Model M that comes my way because every rivet will break eventually. And somebody has to do it. But that's just me. Plus, they feel much better with a bolt mod.

Bolt modding does not take as many time as people thinks. Actually, once you have the tools and the screws (use screws !) it can be done really fast. It helps in cleaning and the result is just perfect.

In my case, if (I cannot clean the board or keys do not work correctly) and (the board does not have historical value), it gets modded.

seebart · 07 May 2015, 17:59

I've never attempted a bolt / screw mod but I can say typing feel is great on my SSK which Madhias screw modded.

hammelgammler · 07 May 2015, 18:22

Like i said, time is not really an issue for me, even if one SSK would take a whole day.
As the only advantage with screws is that it's faster i will definitly do the nut-and-bolt-mod.

As i mentioned, it seems like:
bolt-mod (screws)
advantage: faster, lower cost (only screws)
disadvantage: more precise drilling because of screws, not easy to open it after the mod (ISO mod)

nut-and-bolt-mod
advantage: holes doesn't need to be as precise, more solid?, easy to open
disadvantage: slower, higher cost

As i don't really know how precise i can drill with a standard drill, all speaks for the nut-and-bolt-mod for me.

Can somebody confirm that the holes doesn't need to be as precise? Seems logic to be though, as the holes are only needed to put the bolt's through?

Redmaus · 07 May 2015, 18:26

I recommend a nut and bolt mod because it is easy to fine tune how tight the bolts are.

Madhias · 07 May 2015, 20:50

You got 3 SSKs? That's a big loot!

hammelgammler · 07 May 2015, 20:53

Yeah three SSK's. But not for me alone.

One is for my girlfriend and the other one for a friend of mine.

Khers · 07 May 2015, 21:38

I have a nut-and-bolt modded SSK (not done by me) and I would strongly advice against it. Find some nice counter sunk screws and perform a screw mod instead. The bolt inevitably takes up some space inside the case. Space that isn't really there...

Muirium · 07 May 2015, 22:00

I've got three now too. I'll see about selling one eventually. Only need one for use and the other NIB!

As for bolt mods: I went the whole bolt route on the M122 and it wasn't smart. I found accuracy difficult, and the bolts very tedious to equalise in tension so it would feel much good. Then came the fight of squeezing on the case! Probably better going the other route. Or any route, really, besides!

fohat · 08 May 2015, 02:47

idollar wrote: ↑
prdlm2009 wrote: ↑ I bolt mod every Model M that comes my way because every rivet will break eventually.
Bolt modding does not take as many time as people thinks.

The first time, it will take several hours and the holes may not be very accurate.

After doing it about 3-4 times it will be much easier and faster.

Redmaus · 08 May 2015, 06:04

Khers wrote: ↑I have a nut-and-bolt modded SSK (not done by me) and I would strongly advice against it. Find some nice counter sunk screws and perform a screw mod instead. The bolt inevitably takes up some space inside the case. Space that isn't really there...

I just grab a file and trim the screws that don't allow it to fit.

idollar · 08 May 2015, 08:32

hammelgammler wrote: ↑ As i don't really know how precise i can drill with a standard drill, all speaks for the nut-and-bolt-mod for me.

Can somebody confirm that the holes doesn't need to be as precise? Seems logic to be though, as the holes are only needed to put the bolt's through?

I use a dremel press to do my holes.
Check this very nice thread with all the information that you need, including the type of screws that you can get in Germany.
Thanks once more to Madhias

Do not miss this important information:

With the screws that I copied from Madhias, I had to use a 1,5m hole.
When I used nut/bolts I used a 2mm hole.

If you are afraid of doing yourself PM me. I will work on my brand-old SSK from Cyndy in a couple of weeks. I could do yours also ... I live in Germany.

Madhias · 08 May 2015, 08:44

Also checkout Phosophorglows video, it is very inspiring, has nice music and lots of great tips & tricks!

Redmaus · 08 May 2015, 13:53

Where to find a bunch of this music? And that is an amazing vid.

acolombo · 08 May 2015, 14:31

Redmaus wrote: ↑Where to find a bunch of this music? And that is an amazing vid.

Keygens

hammelgammler · 08 May 2015, 20:56

Hey ho,

I finally got all of them in a pretty good shape.
No keys are stuck anymore.

Just a quick question, the spacebar on my full size Model M doesn't want to work in my SSK. Like if it doesn't fit properly...
Does someone know what the issue could be?

fohat · 09 May 2015, 02:44

hammelgammler wrote: ↑Hey ho,

I finally got all of them in a pretty good shape.
No keys are stuck anymore.

Just a quick question, the spacebar on my full size Model M doesn't want to work in my SSK. Like if it doesn't fit properly...
Does someone know what the issue could be?

Is it seated properly, and are the stabilizer wires comfortable in their tabs?