Post your keyboard/keycaps!

sethk · 11 Sep 2015, 01:36

, one of my Endgame Vintage Cherry boards! Now I just need a 5k w/ a box and I will have all the Cherry boards I want besides the unobtainable ones!

cookie · 11 Sep 2015, 12:26

Muirium wrote: ↑
cookie wrote: ↑I am so misunderstand!
Fixed!

How?

hammelgammler · 11 Sep 2015, 16:19

Finally, I think I'm done with the AT. I really need some nice keycaps for the right part though...
Only the xwhatsit is left.

I really nailed the spacebar stabilizer part though, it feels even better then the original one from the F122 or a SSK.

: Model F AT.jpg (973.62 KiB) Viewed 7780 times

Nuum · 11 Sep 2015, 16:36

Nice, I've recently done this mod to my AT as well. I'm simply holding down the spacebar stab wire with some Scotch tape, works like a charm since about a month, but I fear it's not a permanent solution.
How did you do your spacebar stab?

Muirium · 11 Sep 2015, 17:02

Yes! Details! I want to do this mod too.

hammelgammler · 22 Sep 2015, 22:48

Oh yeah, details. I totally forgot about that. I will do that.

I just realized how nice the bottom row of Round 5 SA keycaps are, is that normal or just because of his keyboard?
The spacebar is at the opposite angle like on a SSK, and even the rest of the bottom is facing to you!
That's something that i really hate about the SSK. Inverting the spacebar could be an option for most Cherry Users, but that's a bit too much of an angle for me. I think that could be about right.

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tigpha · 23 Sep 2015, 18:41

IBM Model F -- Favourite among my collection so far, in the sun of the autumn equinox.

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Muirium · 23 Sep 2015, 19:27

Nicely captured.

IBM didn't spare on the caps, back then. Good tough PBT, full of texture. And legends as dark and thick as if they were painted on by an expert Helvetica hand.

Muirium · 23 Sep 2015, 20:14

hammelgammler wrote: ↑I just realized how nice the bottom row of Round 5 SA keycaps are, is that normal or just because of his keyboard?
The spacebar is at the opposite angle like on a SSK, and even the rest of the bottom is facing to you!
That's something that i really hate about the SSK. Inverting the spacebar could be an option for most Cherry Users, but that's a bit too much of an angle for me. I think that could be about right.

SA's flat last row is pretty smart. We were just discussing this, actually. Jacobolus has a thread full of different profiles, conveniently displayed so you can compare them at a glance. Here's SA:

When mounted on a tilted keyboard, like the one in your picture, SA's bottom row goes with the flow instead of jutting forward, towards your thumbs. I like that too. Thumbs are different from fingers, and want their own row to call home!

zslane · 23 Sep 2015, 20:17

Jacobolus is a hero for taking all those profile photos. I like that 3-1-2-3-4-3 profile. I like 1-1-2-3-4-3 even better (all hail Round 5 Honey).

hammelgammler · 23 Sep 2015, 20:28

Wow, when compared to the IBM profile you can clearly see the massive difference in angle!
Man, now I really want to have some SA blanks. Sad that I don't like Cherrys anymore, and together with the adapter from MX to Alps mount, I think there are a bit too high for me. And the wobble may be a problem with that.

Any news when we have SA profile for buckling spring or Alps?

zslane · 23 Sep 2015, 20:31

Right after we get SA caps for the Topre mount...

Khers · 23 Sep 2015, 20:39

...which come right after IBM sphericals, of course!

tigpha · 23 Sep 2015, 20:51

Muirium wrote: ↑Nicely captured.

Thank you.

Muirium wrote: ↑IBM didn't spare on the caps, back then. Good tough PBT, full of texture. And legends as dark and thick as if they were painted on by an expert Helvetica hand.

Is there a name for the old-school "top hat" style of keys?

The two things I might consider changing are the cylindrical profile key tops to spherical, maybe keeping the "top hat" style, and building a compact 60% Model F for easy transport. The Bigfoot is not itinerant!

I suppose the cylindrical profile is a compromise that enables the key legend to be sublimed, since the symbol is transferred from flat foil printed with dye. At least, that is according to what I discovered from this entrepreneur in Japan. The foil would crease if it were forced into the dished tops that furnish the venerable beamsprings of the previous generation. Pity.

The Bigfoot has spoilt me. I now find the Cherry boards less appealing. The KBT Pure has fallen from favour since experiencing The Model F.

P.s. "It isn't Helvetica" apparently, Murium!

tigpha · 23 Sep 2015, 20:58

Khers wrote: ↑...which come right after IBM sphericals, of course!

Hear hear!

guk · 23 Sep 2015, 21:05

tigpha wrote: ↑P.s. "It isn't Helvetica" apparently, Murium!

It will always remain Helvetica for µ. A shudder of pleasure runs down his spine whenever he thinks/types or speaks out that word.

Muirium · 23 Sep 2015, 21:12

tigpha wrote: ↑P.s. "It isn't Helvetica" apparently, Murium!

Yes, I read that a while ago, and he is quite right. Looking at the Page Down key on my Realforce here, it definitely looks more like Mr. Nakazato's Helvetica Light test cap on the left than the IBM original on the right:

While the Page Down on my IBMs are all just like the one on the right.

Overall, it's a subtle difference that only really shows up on those text mods. The telltale capital G key is much closer to Heletica than Cherry's round G, or indeed any fools out there using Arial today! So I'm still calling IBM's legends Helvetica until we know what obscure Helvetica clone they were actually using, back in the day.

Fortunately, Topre gets it right!

tigpha · 23 Sep 2015, 21:46

Muirium wrote: ↑
tigpha wrote: ↑P.s. "It isn't Helvetica" apparently, Murium!
Yes, I read that a while ago, and he is quite right. Looking at the Page Down key on my Realforce here, it definitely looks more like Mr. Nakazato's Helvetica Light test cap on the left than the IBM original on the right...

I do admire the dogged persistence of monsieur Nakazato san. Gill Sans is an elegant typeface I like to see in a body of text, but each letter in isolation on the keys seem slightly out of place. The original IBM Selectric font is interesting, the square proportions and weight of each letter stand well in isolation, fitting well in the slightly oval square frame of the key tops. The limitations of double-shot molding of that time show: my opinion is that the Selectric "G" could be more elegantly drawn. As discussed elsewhere, fonts and kerning are tricky to get Just Right™.

tigpha · 23 Sep 2015, 22:00

I used to be a technical draughtsman before CAD was widely used, and hand lettering was one of the skills learnt. The Selectric font looks very much like hand drawn gothic letters, such as those illustrated in Plate III on page 35 of "Free-Hand Lettering"

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... Getting really old-school now!

Muirium · 23 Sep 2015, 22:25

Getting right into the business of typography now, good stuff!

I like that Q. But not so much the G, and the lowercase is all kinds of… oh, all right, oldschool!

Speaking of Q, I think you're right. Here's IBM's, on a 3276 beamspring:

So much better's than SP's "Call that a Q?" in Gorton:

Q should not look like an O.

The alternate g and t glyphs are interesting. Love that geometric t (the second one). But the geometric g (the first one, oddly enough!) is too short in the bowl for my taste.

zslane · 23 Sep 2015, 23:11

The letters on that 3276 are quite excellent, but the punctuation glyphs are all over the place in terms of perceived size. Could use a good once-over by Matt3o...

Muirium · 23 Sep 2015, 23:18

Yup. Beamsprings are my favourite switch of all, and the caps are magnificently shaped, but the legends are a bit hokey in their own way too. I still prefer the cool elegance of Helvetica to those quirky doubleshot fonts.

Looking around for pictures to illustrate this stuff, I think I need to take some good comparison shots of my HHKB and Realforce to put alongside the NMB, which is another non-IBM board with some fine Helvetica dyesubs:

Think I've got doubleshot Alps board with something close to Helvetica on it as well. Need to explore the collection…

hammelgammler · 23 Sep 2015, 23:29

Wow, they seem like they have a bad ass texture on them! And the legends are looking very nice as well! Man I love Dyesubs.
I really need some Dyesubs for Alps...

OleVoip · 23 Sep 2015, 23:50

tigpha wrote: ↑... Getting really old-school now!

That reminds me of the keycap font SIemens used in the 1970s/80s,

edit: Sorry, I have to correct myself: For the umlauts , they did it differently such that the letters have their regular size and smaller dots are put on top. Furthermore, this only shows the construction - the end result was not as edgy as this.

Muirium · 24 Sep 2015, 00:01

Mmm… that 7. Those Ümlauts! Got any pics of those boards?

hammelgammler wrote: ↑Wow, they seem like they have a bad ass texture on them! And the legends are looking very nice as well! Man I love Dyesubs.

They're awesome indeed. I love that board. Mad clicky switches, great caps.

http://deskthority.net/review-f45/nmb-r ... t8469.html

hammelgammler wrote: ↑I really need some Dyesubs for Alps...

Vintage Apple boards are a good source. Very cosy shapes:

That's a salmon AEK I.

zuglufttier · 24 Sep 2015, 09:33

I guess, it shouldn't be extremely difficult to make a font from photos of those IBM keyboards...

I must admit that the legends have a very good readability. Not that it matters too much but it just looks better

OleVoip · 24 Sep 2015, 14:35

Muirium wrote: ↑Mmm… that 7. Those Ümlauts! Got any pics of those boards?

1980s http://www.dosforum.de/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=8842

1960s http://old.fernschreibamt-hausneindorf. ... t100s.html

1930s http://old.fernschreibamt-hausneindorf.de/html/t34.html

After being happy with this font for more than 50 years, they switched to Univers towards the end of 1980s - along with the change from doubleshots to lasered keycaps, followed by the replacement of mechanical switches by rubber domes. (Thus, if you find a bord with a proper Siemens "7", you can expect a switch underneath.) Those rare mechanical "Siemens" boards made nowadays are based on Cherry keys and have Cherry-Helvetica labelling.

(edit: Univers, not Universe)

kbdfr · 24 Sep 2015, 16:20

These tasty 7 and 4 caps remind me of the numpad of some Preh point of sale keyboards which,
although being rubberdomes, managed to use doubleshot caps with apparently that exact font:

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OleVoip · 24 Sep 2015, 17:08

Sorry, I meant to say that a "Siemens board with a proper Siemens '7'" has a switch underneath. The font was designed about 1930 under Siemens guidance, based on a Prussian precursor, and is known as DIN-1415. It is often seen in Germany, where it is also used for public road signs (in its modern variant).