[Spharx▼]

This is possible but not comfortable since only the modules that are connected through the Tipro Bus can be programmed together (without a main cable switching) in the ChangeMe software.
If you open the case of a module you will see a flat cable which that you can connect the devices together.
One Bus of the right side of every module is going to be put in the left side port of an other module (on the pcb). If you want to use the Bus you will need joiners to keep the modules together and therefore not damaging the bus cable trough over-stretching or other cable killer situations.

[7bit▼]

My MID Tipro is not recognised by Changeme. What am I doing wrong?

More info: it's a 8x4 module from 7bit, and it lights up and beeps when palm pressing.

Or am I supposed to use a "tipro cabel" instead of ps2?

You need the cable. Maybe we should organise a group buy.

Just tested those and got the expected results:

• $E0,$2B - Windows calculator opens
• $12,$33,$F0,$12,$43,$29,$2B,$44,$4B,$42,$1B - writes Hi folks (make and break codes for capital H included)

My keyboard is a MID, yours a TMC (found your picture), but I rather doubt your problem has anything to do with that. Try programming your code sequences on one of (hüstel, hüstel) your 8x4 MID keyboards, then we'll know.
And perhaps you should try a higher interbyte delay (Preferences -> Keyboard settings).

It is the TMC something (viewtopic.php?f=8&t=87).
The interbyte delay could be an option. However, I've tried the 3270 terminal emulator as one of you suggested and it is possible to enter some of the key codes with that but they still don't register under Linux. The G80-2550 works fine, BTW.

I believe that the keyboard sends USB signals rather than scancode set 2 and these get filtered out by the system or by the hardware.

You've tested with windows? For some reason, it works with windows without the break codes, but it does not with Linux and I need it to work with Linux.

$12,$33,$F0,$12,$43,$29,$2B,$44,$4B,$42,$1B
^^^^$F0 starts a break code. But the others are no break codes at all.

To be continued ....

[Spharx▼]

You need the cable. Maybe we should organise a group buy.

Make your own Tipro cable using a male/male PS/2 cable: carefully and completely remove the small plastic tongue between the pins on one end of the cable. The plug will now fit into the 8-pin socket of the keyboard

Works perfectly ! So no groupbuys needed

[7bit▼]

You need the cable. Maybe we should organise a group buy.

Make your own Tipro cable using a male/male PS/2 cable: carefully and completely remove the small plastic tongue between the pins on one end of the cable. The plug will now fit into the 8-pin socket of the keyboard

Works perfectly ! So no groupbuys needed

You mean you can program it without the extra pins/wires in the plug/cable?

Nevertheless, It works!!! I've raised the interbyte time to the maximum possible and it finally works!!!

I think the reason why it worked with the Windows box from the beginning, was that it is newer and can handle higher speeds.

Thanks everybody for your patience with me!

ps: It is now hotplugable!

[Minskleip▼]

I tried with my home made cable and now it works with the old configuration, but I can't reprogram it.. my pc got fucked up so it could be that. I'm restoring now.. Something erased my PATH for fucks sake

Sent from my HTC Vision using Tapatalk

[Minskleip▼]

I got Internet restored back! PATH is lost, but at least I've got a somewhat functional system. I'll have to add to it whenever stuff breaks. Anyway, my Tipro is still not detected by the software! Any suggestions? I'm using a modified cable from the Tipro-hole to ps2 on the computer. Everything works except reprogramming it.

It actually works with the Teensy ps2 -> usb converter too, but if I wanted to use that (to get mouse keys for instance), I'd like to clean it up first.

Btw, can I get mouse keys with Changeme?

[7bit▼]

I tried with my home made cable and now it works with the old configuration, but I can't reprogram it.. my pc got fucked up so it could be that. I'm restoring now.. Something erased my PATH for fucks sake

Sent from my HTC Vision using Tapatalk

If it runs Windows, the fuck-up happened much earlier!

Set the inter-byte delay as high as possible this should eliminate failures when pluggin it back in.

ChangeMe.exe crashed sometimes when I reconnected the Tipro after I had Num Lock or Caps Lock on during the upload of the configuration. Also, when switching back from scan-code input mode to that other mode (don't remember how it's called), it crashes sometimes.

ps: Sorry for not sending any Tipros today, but I had no time ...

I got Internet restored back! PATH is lost, but at least I've got a somewhat functional system. I'll have to add to it whenever stuff breaks. Anyway, my Tipro is still not detected by the software! Any suggestions? I'm using a modified cable from the Tipro-hole to ps2 on the computer. Everything works except reprogramming it.

It actually works with the Teensy ps2 -> usb converter too, but if I wanted to use that (to get mouse keys for instance), I'd like to clean it up first.

Btw, can I get mouse keys with Changeme?

I bet you need the cable!
If this is not the problem:
I've connected the Tipro via PS/2 and another keyboard via USB. It also works with the other keyboard in that 2nd PS/2-plug of the Tipro.

You need to re-boot the system with everything plugged in!

edit: echo $PATH
/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/games:/usr/global/bin
^^^ Is that helpful?

[Minskleip▼]

I would if the software would detect anything. I may try to install winxp on an old computer, if it still works. Have to find power cables first blah.

Aha, if they're still at your place, then that's better than being lost in the mail! No worries. Thanks for the keys

I bet you need the cable!
If this is not the problem:
I've connected the Tipro via PS/2 and another keyboard via USB. It also works with the other keyboard in that 2nd PS/2-plug of the Tipro.

You need to re-boot the system with everything plugged in!

I have Das II connected to USB via Teensy, and Tipro in PS2. I'll try without the Teensy. Everything is in and have been rebooted many times.

edit: echo $PATH
/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/games:/usr/global/bin
^^^ Is that helpful?

Thanks, but no; I already have an OpenBSD box with that information

[7bit▼]

I have Das II connected to USB via Teensy, and Tipro in PS2. I'll try without the Teensy. Everything is in and have been rebooted many times.
[quote=7bit]
edit: echo $PATH
/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/games:/usr/global/bin
^^^ Is that helpful?

Thanks, but no; I already have an OpenBSD box with that information
[/quote]
I will check for the cable. I've got some KVM cable in the office so I can test if it works without the special cable. I'm afraid it is the problem.

Where are the Tipro experts to tell us how to wire the thing together?

[intealls▼]

GAH! Haven't gotten mine yet. You guys aren't making the wait any easier!

To wire them together, I think you need to open the side of the unit or something and connect the 6-pin connector directly in to the slave module of the other unit? Haven't really understood it completely. This document might be of help : http://www.perimatic.fr/documentations/Tipro/MID/TiproMID%20KM032%20Modules%20Technical%20Overview.pdf.pdf

[Minskleip▼]

Here is mine

IMG_20110817_195837.jpeg (763.53 KiB) Viewed 531 times

LED is red, and escape is orange ...

Hope I don't need a special cable to use them :/

[intealls▼]

Here is mine

Lots of good documentation on this site: http://www.perimatic.fr/documentations/Tipro/MID, the user manual is there as well

[kbdfr▼]

I wonder how you guys manage to have so many and so eclectic problems

I had never any crash with ChangeMe. None of my Tipro keyboards ever refused programming. Hot-plugging never caused any trouble. None of my self-made Tipro cables ever refused service. Chaining several keyboards always functioned without any problem, as did connecting them with the Tipro bus. I swapped controllers between keyboards and they never did resent it.

There's one thing, though, which I always do when getting something new: I do read the manual and thoroughly try everything in the software.
It obviously helps:

And perhaps you should try a higher interbyte delay (Preferences -> Keyboard settings).

It works!!! I've raised the interbyte time to the maximum possible and it finally works!!!
I think the reason why it worked with the Windows box from the beginning, was that it is newer and can handle higher speeds.

[intealls▼]

kbdfr, do you know if you have to use the small internal 6-pin connector to chain these modules together?? Or is it possible to connect them some other way?

[7bit▼]

kbdfr, do you know if you have to use the small internal 6-pin connector to chain these modules together?? Or is it possible to connect them some other way?

The cables with the red connectors do the trick!

[kbdfr▼]

kbdfr, do you know if you have to use the small internal 6-pin connector to chain these modules together?? Or is it possible to connect them some other way?

You can chain Tipro keyboards by plugging the first one into the computer (Tipro 8-pin to PS/2), the second one into the first one (Tipro 8-pin to PS/2), the third one into the second one (Tipro 8-pin to PS/2) - I did not try more yet
This way you can operate the keyboards, but only the first one will be recognised and can of course be programmed by the ChangeMe software.

You can connect several keyboards using the Tipro bus (a small, short flat cable plugged onto the PCB of both boards). Obviously only one of them is connected to the computer.
The ChangeMe software recognises and of course programs all keyboards connected this way (I had up to four modules).

Every Tipro keyboard I had so far contained (at least) one Tipro bus.

Edit: good picture showing a Tipro bus, thanks

[Minskleip▼]

I think I found the source of my problem:

(* Please note: PS/2 communication is not supported in 64-bit systems. PS/2 content can be programmed over RS232 communication instead.)

Now I just need to find a 32 bit computer...

[intealls▼]

Okay, thanks kbdfr & 7bit!

tipro-split.jpg (27.57 KiB) Viewed 513 times

I plan on using two of them to make one complete keyboard, as depicted by the attached picture, so I think I'm going to have to come up with a way to make the connection external, perhaps jack the existing PS/2 connectors??

[Minskleip▼]

A cool mod would be to make the bus connector external with a nice sleeved cable!

intealls, I'm planning the same, and I was going to connect them with the "tipro-cable" -> ps2 approach. Can't program the second module on the fly, but they'd be maneuverable.

[intealls▼]

Cool, it's a great idea

I *think* the problem with that setup would be that the modules are not able to share the same layer configuration, so if you shift to layer 2 on device one, device two will not shift to that layer. I need them to share the layer config :/

[7bit▼]

I think I found the source of my problem:

(* Please note: PS/2 communication is not supported in 64-bit systems. PS/2 content can be programmed over RS232 communication instead.)

Now I just need to find a 32 bit computer...

The windows box which I employed is 64 bit but I believe it runs Windows XP.

How is the RS232 connection made?

[Minskleip▼]

I think I found the source of my problem:

(* Please note: PS/2 communication is not supported in 64-bit systems. PS/2 content can be programmed over RS232 communication instead.)

Now I just need to find a 32 bit computer...

The windows box which I employed is 64 bit but I believe it runs Windows XP.

How is the RS232 connection made?

With official cable?

RS232 is the old com port?

Sent from my HTC Vision using Tapatalk

[intealls▼]

It looks like you need a real Tipro cable for that :/

Check page 9-10 (13-14 pdf count) in http://www.perimatic.fr/documentations/Tipro/MID/MID%20UserManuel.pdf

They mention a split cable which I think will connect to the 'Tipro'-port.

[Minskleip▼]

Cool, it's a great idea

I *think* the problem with that setup would be that the modules are not able to share the same layer configuration, so if you shift to layer 2 on device one, device two will not shift to that layer. I need them to share the layer config :/

Oh bummer. Anyone to confirm this?

Sent from my HTC Vision using Tapatalk

[Minskleip▼]

I installed WinXP on an old machine, and it worked! The only failure was multimedia buttons and F>12, but I'll try again tomorrow!

[Spharx▼]

Multimedia Buttons won't work with the old version controllers (3.*) .. every mid module I saw had old controllers

[Minskleip▼]

Lol? Isn't it just a scan code? Is it the same for F13 and up too?

[Spharx▼]

Yep its a scancode that the controller does not support. At least F13 & etc. will do do job.
Look at the second post, there should be all codes that the controller is able to work with (if I found all )

[Minskleip▼]

Ah cool, thanks! Guess I'll have to hook it up to the teensy ...

[kbdfr▼]

I *think* the problem with that setup would be that the modules are not able to share the same layer configuration, so if you shift to layer 2 on device one, device two will not shift to that layer. I need them to share the layer config :/

Oh bummer. Anyone to confirm this?

I'm not quite sure what exactly is to be confirmed, but here is the way Tipro modules connected with each other work:

• "extern" connection (module 1 connected to the computer, module 2 connected to the PS/2 port of module 1):
  - only module 1 is recognised by the programming software and can be programmed;
  - modules share NumLock, CapsLock and ScrollLock: press key on any module, all modules will be affected;
  - modules do not share ShiftToLayerX nor LockToLayerX: each module where these functions are used is affected individually;
  - modules do not share Shift, module 2 will affect module 1 but not the other way round. In other words, the command works towards the computer but not inversely. So Shift+a on any module will deliver A, Shift(module2)+a(module1) will deliver A, but Shift(module1)+a(module2) will have the effect of blocking output as long as Shift is pressed and then delivering a.
• "intern" connection (module 1and module 2 connected via Tipro bus):
  - all modules are recognised by the programming software and can be programmed;
  - all modules share everything. Shift(any module)+a(any module) will always deliver A. In fact, all modules together act as one keyboard.

So obviously the idea of a split keyboard requires both modules to be connected via Tipro bus, which in its actual form (very short cable connects units joined together side by side) is... incompatible with a split keyboard. It would be necessary to "externalise" the Tipro bus so that keyboards can be connected via an external cable.

In my opininon the best solution would be to install a socket on the small removable cover at the rear of the keyboard (which obviously is prepared for adding such a socket, PS/2 size) and connect it to the Tipro bus. The Tipro connector itself could be used for units up to 8x8, bigger units would require a somewhat longer internal cable. This solution would have the advantage of leaving the keyboard itself completely unaffected otherwise and of allowing swapping between any Tipro keyboards.

If anyone has the necessary skills, I'd be interested in six units, please