Are Black ALPS clicky?

ndp

29 Oct 2012, 23:07

I own 2 AT101 Dell keyboards.

The first one is very used, the switches are quite hard to press, with a lot of friction. The keys also make something like a click: a noisy one, different from the white or blue ALPS.
So from that experience, I would classify the Black ALPS as clicky and tactile.

That was until this morning. I've just receive my second AT101. This one is NIB. No click, the switches are just tactiles.
I pull up a cap, just to check if it also come with Black ALPS, and just because I removed the cap, the switch started to make that noisy click!!! :shock:
The caps on the Dell are hard to removed, I guess a part of the switch may have moved.

Anyone else had a similar experience?

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Daniel Beardsmore

30 Oct 2012, 01:29

Positively not clicky, though the interaction between the stem and the tactile leaf does cause a faint click. They're a pretty scrapy, noisy and rough switch even when new. Nothing like the silky smooth and precise blue Alps switch. I did use another tactile Alps board (orange or pink I think) and that was much nicer, but opinion varies on whether black Alps really was worse than earlier tactile variants. Probably needs some of that Japanese Alps lube.

Anyway … see http://deskthority.net/wiki/File:Dell_A ... switch.jpg — disassembled black Alps from an AT102W.

The folded sheet of metal lying on the case at the top left is the tactile leaf. The slider snags on this, and the process of forcing its way past the protruding "hooks" gives the tactile feel. The construction of this leaf is critical to feel, and this is what other manufacturers keep getting wrong (why XMs are balky and Fukkas ping so much).

The click sound is caused when the slider snags on the leaf and pulls the whole leaf forwards (front and back together), and then twangs it back against the case once it clears the hooks. This metal-on-plastic impact gives Alps switches a more distinguinshed sound than Cherry's plastic-on-plastic mechanism.

You can see four side tabs perpendicular to the rear half of the leaf. The bottom two (to the right) are always present. The top two (on the left) are present in tactile switches, and they ensure that the switch doesn't click, by preventing the leaf from being pulled forward – the leaf serves only to snag the slider momentarily. There used to be some nice diagrams showing how this worked. We need someone to render some Alps switches in 3D to show how they function.

The snag approach is also why there's so little pretravel on Alps: you can't build up force smoothly this way.

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Matias

01 Nov 2012, 14:55

Black ALPS have always been one of my favourites...

They are tactile but technically not clicky. The "click" you hear is actually from bottoming out, not from the click leaf. The click leaf doesn't click. It just provides tactile feedback.

If you want tactile with a little bit of click, Black ALPS is a great option IMO.

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Daniel Beardsmore

01 Nov 2012, 15:08

No, you do get a very faint click from them if you press gently. It's not intentional though.

xsphat

02 Nov 2012, 20:13

Alps have lost quite a bit of popularity since I was into this stuff a couple years ago. Why is that?

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JesuswasaZombie

02 Nov 2012, 20:39

probably because Cherry has pretty much been the go to switch for the gaming market which is what is fueling the majority of high end keyboards these days.

xsphat

02 Nov 2012, 20:43

OK, i was wondering if there was any reason other than Cherry's marketing machine. I still think Topre makes the best feeling switch.

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fossala
Elite +1

02 Nov 2012, 20:44

xsphat wrote:OK, i was wondering if there was any reason other than Cherry's marketing machine. I still think Topre makes the best feeling switch.
I like you already :)

xsphat

02 Nov 2012, 20:50

fossala wrote:
xsphat wrote:OK, i was wondering if there was any reason other than Cherry's marketing machine. I still think Topre makes the best feeling switch.
I like you already :)
Thanks, lol. I have a little history with webwit, but that aside I have been in the keyboard scene since the first month of GH (check my profile) and I've had a lot of 'boards. I started on Alps, then went to buckling springs and Cherry and Topre. Now I'm looking to get into a Cherry tenkeyless, maybe red, maybe blue, so I'm back mainly to decide what to ultimately get and where the cool keysets can be picked up in the USA. Plus there is all this new moodification stuff like aluminum cases and stuff.

And on a final ripster note, my kid doesn't even have any legos - he plays Minecraft so they seem so antiquated to him.

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Matias

02 Nov 2012, 23:57

JesuswasaZombie wrote:probably because Cherry has pretty much been the go to switch for the gaming market which is what is fueling the majority of high end keyboards these days.
That and the fact that ALPS switches were much harder to obtain, with the manufacturer constantly threatening to cease production. No one wants to make a product where the key component could disappear from existence at any time. That's the main reason we created our own ALPS variant (http://matias.ca/quietpro).

Fuhua shot themselves in both feet. All Cherry had to do was keep walking.

ndp

03 Nov 2012, 13:38

xsphat wrote:Alps have lost quite a bit of popularity since I was into this stuff a couple years ago. Why is that?
Where are all these ALPS keyboards ? Not in the market place, there's a majority of Cherry stuff.

xsphat

03 Nov 2012, 23:33

ndp wrote:
xsphat wrote:Alps have lost quite a bit of popularity since I was into this stuff a couple years ago. Why is that?
Where are all these ALPS keyboards ? Not in the market place, there's a majority of Cherry stuff.
Is there an echo in here? A few years ago there were lots of Alps 'boards, now there are like 7.

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Vierax

04 Nov 2012, 01:13

And on a final ripster note, my kid doesn't even have any legos - he plays Minecraft so they seem so antiquated to him.
That's a shame I remember having a lot of fun with those bricks and created a lot of things and stories. I play Minecraft too but it's not the same feel.

BTW Your son could maybe help you with a project like this http://www.southampton.ac.uk/mediacentr ... uter.shtml but he'll do the programming stuff and you'll play with Legos :D

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