Shit, I fell for it

User avatar
Inxie

06 Sep 2020, 21:09

After reading the back and forth here, OP is the prime example I refuse to sell on eBay, because people don't READ THE DESCRIPTION when I ask them too. No, you are in a binding contract to pay, if you pull out and screw the seller over, you are going to be at fault on the legal side of things, and the seller has every right then to go after you to collect. It was YOUR fault for not reading and now you need to suck it up and buy the computer. Re-sell the computer then or something that's fine, but he has every right to not cancel it either as per eBay's rules.

Sorry but I don't cater to people who dig their own graves then whine about it because they aren't getting a refund. It's your fault, own up to it.

Also, when I sold on eBay, when someone cancels like that, it punishes the seller, and we have to pay out of our own pocket (does eBay still not charge you for listings?). Either way, it's his right and he's clearly covering his behind because he knows you cancelling would punish him, and not you and that's not "ethically right" either. Catch my drift? You think it's not ethically right against yourself, but it wouldn't be ethically right for you to punish him either. Goes both ways.

mode1ace

06 Sep 2020, 22:10

Anj is somewhat shady, but, the bottom line here is read the description.

I got burned by him a while back "pristine switches no cleaning or lubing necessary" == filled with dust, mediocre condition, some wear that no amount of cleaning will fix.

User avatar
ddrfraser1

06 Sep 2020, 22:26

Inxie wrote:
06 Sep 2020, 21:09
After reading the back and forth here, OP is the prime example I refuse to sell on eBay, because people don't READ THE DESCRIPTION when I ask them too. No, you are in a binding contract to pay, if you pull out and screw the seller over, you are going to be at fault on the legal side of things, and the seller has every right then to go after you to collect. It was YOUR fault for not reading and now you need to suck it up and buy the computer. Re-sell the computer then or something that's fine, but he has every right to not cancel it either as per eBay's rules.

Sorry but I don't cater to people who dig their own graves then whine about it because they aren't getting a refund. It's your fault, own up to it.

Also, when I sold on eBay, when someone cancels like that, it punishes the seller, and we have to pay out of our own pocket (does eBay still not charge you for listings?). Either way, it's his right and he's clearly covering his behind because he knows you cancelling would punish him, and not you and that's not "ethically right" either. Catch my drift? You think it's not ethically right against yourself, but it wouldn't be ethically right for you to punish him either. Goes both ways.
I didn’t cancel. You may have missed the part where I said I am owning my mistake.

Sounds like you may have had a bad experience with buyers on the past who have a lack of integrity. Sorry about that. That’s not me. I try to shoot people straight.

While in a vacuum I would agree with you, in the past the seller has tried to deceive people. Yes I should have double checked but that doesn’t change the fact that he’s trying to take advantage.

User avatar
Weezer

06 Sep 2020, 22:42

Inxie wrote:
06 Sep 2020, 21:09
No, you are in a binding contract to pay, if you pull out and screw the seller over, you are going to be at fault on the legal side of things, and the seller has every right then to go after you to collect.
Actually you are not in a legally binding agreement and you can back out. It's just against eBay's rules.

User avatar
dogmantime

06 Sep 2020, 22:44

You should cancel mate, this was andj00's full intention from the start. It was his full intention to bait someone into making this error, and it has worked, he's already had to face people cancelling purchases on his Apple IIc multiple times for the same reason. Mistake purchases (which is what this was, albeit a silly one) are even accounted for as an option in eBay's cancellation process. Stupid mistakes are nothing out of the ordinary and can happen to any one of us, regardless of the impression people in this thread might be putting forth. Personally I think it's even sillier to think you have to "own" this one, his minor inconvenience pales in comparison to your $100.

And as if we needed further confirmation he's a con artist:
mode1ace wrote:
06 Sep 2020, 22:10
I got burned by him a while back "pristine switches no cleaning or lubing necessary" == filled with dust, mediocre condition, some wear that no amount of cleaning will fix.
Yet people on here will still wade into the matter fresh as a newborn, disregarding context and nuances, and the cycle repeats and people get away with scummy behaviour.

User avatar
Weezer

06 Sep 2020, 23:10

dogmantime wrote:
06 Sep 2020, 22:44
Yet people on here will still wade into the matter fresh as a newborn, disregarding context and nuances, and the cycle repeats and people get away with scummy behaviour.
At the risk of being overly philosophical, I think it has to do with people's attitudes towards consumerism in general, where the customer is always right, so therefore if you mess up it's your fault. I've had similar conversations with people about price gouging laws. Many people place the onus on the consumer to be a 4D chessmaster and not on the seller to shoot straight and not be deceptive. It's a little dismaying because sellers and corporations in general have a lot more power than consumers in the first place.

User avatar
Bass

06 Sep 2020, 23:23

dogmantime wrote:
06 Sep 2020, 22:44
You should cancel mate, this was andj00's full intention from the start. It was his full intention to bait someone into making this error, and it has worked, he's already had to face people cancelling purchases on his Apple IIc multiple times for the same reason. Mistake purchases (which is what this was, albeit a silly one) are even accounted for as an option in eBay's cancellation process. Stupid mistakes are nothing out of the ordinary and can happen to any one of us, regardless of the impression people in this thread might be putting forth. Personally I think it's even sillier to think you have to "own" this one, his minor inconvenience pales in comparison to your $100.

And as if we needed further confirmation he's a con artist:
mode1ace wrote:
06 Sep 2020, 22:10
I got burned by him a while back "pristine switches no cleaning or lubing necessary" == filled with dust, mediocre condition, some wear that no amount of cleaning will fix.
Yet people on here will still wade into the matter fresh as a newborn, disregarding context and nuances, and the cycle repeats and people get away with scummy behaviour.
I mean, I agree that the seller's past antics were definitely worth some amount of condemnation, but you cannot honestly say they are at fault this time. Not only was the switch swap mentioned in the description, but they even went out of the way to remind prospective buyers to read the description in the title. The asking price of $100 reflects this. The important lesson to take away from this is that if something seems too good to be true, it probably is (for ebay listings in particular).

Maybe a good compromise would be for the seller to offer a partial refund? (ie, subtracting listing fees and paypal fees if applicable)

User avatar
Willy4876

07 Sep 2020, 00:22

My two cents on the matter:

- It sucks that you are stuck buying a computer that is not what you expected. Yes, you should have read the description and I don't think that he should be obligated to offer a refund. It still sucks.

- Andj was clear in the ad (I also saw it on ebay), but I really don't like the practice of parting out keyboards to turn a quick profit and it looks like he has been doing it for a while. I think that it is fair to list the computer even with replaced switches because $100 is a good price if you want an Apple IIc as the computer or for Apple IIc parts. Keep in mind that there are probably quite a few people in the vintage computer community who don't like the mech community because we take all of these keyboards off of the market and leave computers with proprietary interfaces (NeXT, some SGI computers, old Apple computers, IBM terminals etc.) without their HIDs.

- I have no idea what Andj has done in the past so I cannot comment on that

User avatar
Nasanieru

07 Sep 2020, 00:28

I have bought from andj00 once before, and that was my first time ever performing a transaction using a forum classifieds post. It was for a replacement DIN cable. Even though I was new to the community, even I could recognize that his asking price of $20 shipped was far too high, as I was hoping for just the cable for the shipping cost.

I peeked through his past as as a seller and found that he was NOT the kind of person to attempt to haggle with. The price alone was a sign of this. I decided to just eat the cost because I had a lot of trouble finding the cable for at least a month (GH and r/mechmarket had no similar listings) and the board in question that the cable was for was my first-ever ALPS board but it had a bad cable.

He's active over at r/mechmarket. His prices are still insanely high for ALPS switches that probably haven't even been cleaned if they weren't already NOS.

Jacobalbertus1

07 Sep 2020, 05:52

usealy andj00 is an asshat,but if you took 10 seconds to read the description you would have seen that it was replaced with dampend switches as this is one of the first times he was being clear about it after we road his ass a week or 2 ago here

User avatar
vometia
irritant

07 Sep 2020, 15:20

kbdfr wrote:
06 Sep 2020, 10:19
Basically, the title reads:
Vintage Apple IIC A2S4100 TESTED WORKING (BAD DISK DRIVE, READ DESCRIPTION)
(bolding is mine)
Reviewed bolding is mine: which is how I'd read it.

IMHO the description is deceptive. Yeah, the facts are there but hiding in plain sight.

Reading through the topic, obviously people aren't going to agree on this but IMHO the description was constructed in such a way to say the pertinent facts weren't hidden but to not encourage people to look for them. It could've been a lot clearer. I can't know the seller's mind so I shan't try to speculate on intent.

User avatar
webwit
Wild Duck

07 Sep 2020, 20:21

You're out in round 1! :evil:

Sell on reddit for round 2! :twisted:

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