Cherry with a surprising message to all G80-3000 buyers!
- Halvar
- Location: Baden, DE
- Main keyboard: IBM Model M SSK / Filco MT 2
- Favorite switch: Beam & buckling spring, Monterey, MX Brown
- DT Pro Member: 0051
Cherry now tells you to get rid of your old G80 and buy some new crap every few months instead:
http://www.cherry.de/exchange/
http://www.cherry.de/exchange/#lautstaerke
http://www.cherry.de/exchange/#design
http://www.cherry.de/exchange/
http://www.cherry.de/exchange/#lautstaerke
http://www.cherry.de/exchange/#design
- Dubsgalore
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: ESA-3000-HASRO
- Main mouse: Deathadder 2013
- Favorite switch: MX Blacks
- DT Pro Member: -
Reading that made me feel weird
- ne0phyte
- Toast.
- Location: Germany
- Main keyboard: HHKB Pro 2
- Main mouse: Mionix Avior 7000
- Favorite switch: Topre 45g, MX Blue
- DT Pro Member: 0003
THis is sickening...
KEYBOARDS MAY BECOME WORN.
Workplace RISK 2 > Labeling quality
You should regularly replace your computer input devices if there is any visible wear.
THEY ARE RECOMMENDING RUBBER DOME KEYBOARDS >_>KEYBOARDS CAN BE UGLY.
Workplace RISK 4 > Design
Input devices are often hopelessly outdated. Technically, ergonomically and from a data-protection perspective
- Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
They are recommending you give them your money. Makes sense when you think of it in cold, hard cash. Long lived classic keyboards are worse than junk to them: they are a distraction from your buying new ones.
- Dubsgalore
- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: ESA-3000-HASRO
- Main mouse: Deathadder 2013
- Favorite switch: MX Blacks
- DT Pro Member: -
I mean it obviously makes sense as to why they are doing this but how terribly ironic and sad it is
especially with their own older 3000s being used in the photos...it's almost depressing
especially with their own older 3000s being used in the photos...it's almost depressing
- Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
A different hand gesture comes to mind for this one…
I'm glad I'm not a Cherry keyboard fan, because that's pretty galling! I especially like the "Preferably with Original CHERRY" text in the corner. They could have used someone else's old boards to illustrate the points, but no, only Original CHERRY is ironic enough to dis!
I'm glad I'm not a Cherry keyboard fan, because that's pretty galling! I especially like the "Preferably with Original CHERRY" text in the corner. They could have used someone else's old boards to illustrate the points, but no, only Original CHERRY is ironic enough to dis!
- Kurk
- Location: Sauce Hollondaise (=The Netherlands)
- Main keyboard: Kinesis Advantage // Filco MJ2 + HID liberation
- Main mouse: ITAC Mousetrak Professional
- DT Pro Member: 0027
Things I have around here:
Cherry G80-3000: check!
Rubrick's cube: check!
Paper clips: check!
Casio classic watch: check!
Pink terry wristband: errrr, no.
I'm not feeling like replacing any of those very soon.
Cherry G80-3000: check!
Rubrick's cube: check!
Paper clips: check!
Casio classic watch: check!
Pink terry wristband: errrr, no.
I'm not feeling like replacing any of those very soon.
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- Location: Cambridge, UK
- Main keyboard: Poker Pure Pro
- Main mouse: Zowie ZA12
- Favorite switch: Cherry Red
- DT Pro Member: -
I'm sorry but that grey/beige color scheme is soooo easy on they eyes, I cannot stand these black keyboards, or these white ones either. Only apple can pull off white and none can pull off black, when it comes to keyboards.
- facetsesame
- Mad Dasher
- Location: UK
- Main keyboard: Ducky Legend
- Main mouse: CST L-Trac
- Favorite switch: MX red for linear, white for click
- DT Pro Member: 0092
"Input devices are underestimated" is not something I would disagree with, but I'm wearing a Casio A158W...
Can't help commenting on the 95/8 win keys in the eighties either. Somehow I don't think this was targeted at us lot.
Perhaps we should have a user-wtb-based bounty page for G80s etc.
Can't help commenting on the 95/8 win keys in the eighties either. Somehow I don't think this was targeted at us lot.
Perhaps we should have a user-wtb-based bounty page for G80s etc.
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- Location: geekhack ergonomics subforum
- Favorite switch: Alps plate spring; clicky SMK
- DT Pro Member: -
So maybe they should go back to PBT dye-subs then.Input devices often become heavily worn, both in their technical functions and ergonomically:
A keyboard with key labeling that is barely visible and keys that stick, for example, prevents you from working smoothly. And it wastes working time.
- Kurk
- Location: Sauce Hollondaise (=The Netherlands)
- Main keyboard: Kinesis Advantage // Filco MJ2 + HID liberation
- Main mouse: ITAC Mousetrak Professional
- DT Pro Member: 0027
I took the freedom to express my feelings about Cherry's suggestions in this skillfully crafted collage:
- Attachments
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- If keyboards were cars. G80 -> DW8000
- G80_to_crap_is_like.jpg (137.38 KiB) Viewed 7722 times
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- Location: Cambridge, UK
- Main keyboard: Poker Pure Pro
- Main mouse: Zowie ZA12
- Favorite switch: Cherry Red
- DT Pro Member: -
lulzKurk wrote: ↑I took the freedom to express my feelings about Cherry's suggestions in this skillfully crafted collage:
- Daniel Beardsmore
- Location: Hertfordshire, England
- Main keyboard: Filco Majestouch 1 (home)/Poker II backlit (work)
- Main mouse: MS IMO 1.1
- Favorite switch: Probably not whatever I wrote here
- DT Pro Member: -
- Contact:
Reminds me of someone who had lost so many letters off his keyboard that he wrote scrawled them all back on with correction fluid. I did convince him to replace the keyboard.ne0phyte wrote: ↑THis is sickening...KEYBOARDS MAY BECOME WORN.
Workplace RISK 2 > Labeling quality
You should regularly replace your computer input devices if there is any visible wear.
Cherry would convince me more if their solution was to partner with GMK and return to double-shot moulding (premium black models — other companies besides Apple can charge a premium for black, after all) and dye-sub (beige models).
I am not sure that's genuinely how you would get eye cancer.ne0phyte wrote: ↑THis is sickening...KEYBOARDS CAN BE UGLY.
Workplace RISK 4 > Design
(Staring at Linux desktops on the other hand …)
- Muirium
- µ
- Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
- Main keyboard: HHKB Type-S with Bluetooth by Hasu
- Main mouse: Apple Magic Mouse
- Favorite switch: Gotta Try 'Em All
- DT Pro Member: µ
The 2010's keyboard makers to their 1980s past selves: Durable, premium, hard wearing materials and legends? That will last the test of time!? WHAT WERE YOU THINKING! People will buy shit. Let us show you! And when it's worn THEY WILL COME FOR MORE!
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- Location: Stockholm, Sweden
- DT Pro Member: 0011
The web "designer" who made that web page should be shot for having disabled the horizontal scrollbar.
BTW, notice how those rubber-dome keyboards have inverted-T cluster of keys with Shift and Caps Lock symbols ... and a left-facing shift ... eh.. and right-facing shift symbol ...
And I'm typing on beige and grey Cherry PBT keys like in the picture, purposefully collected from four used keyboards, with the keyboard case painted beige to resemble the hue keyboards from the 1980's.
What you see in the picture is not obsolete, it is the ideal!
BTW, notice how those rubber-dome keyboards have inverted-T cluster of keys with Shift and Caps Lock symbols ... and a left-facing shift ... eh.. and right-facing shift symbol ...
Me too. The official watch of Deskthority.facetsesame wrote: ↑I'm wearing a Casio A158W...
And I'm typing on beige and grey Cherry PBT keys like in the picture, purposefully collected from four used keyboards, with the keyboard case painted beige to resemble the hue keyboards from the 1980's.
What you see in the picture is not obsolete, it is the ideal!
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- Location: USA
- Main keyboard: KBC Poker MX Red
- Main mouse: Logitech MX Revolution
- Favorite switch: MX Red
- DT Pro Member: -
MX technology... obsolete and outdated 80's technology with poor performance. MX technology... best high performance and most reliable keyboards for gaming and demanding professionals!
I like how they illustrate that lasering is not as durable, then turn around and praise lasering.
Clearly some marketing geniuses at work over at ZF!
If they are doing a trade in... perhaps we can negotiate with them to take all those lousy G80 keyboards off their hands for €.50/kg?
I like how they illustrate that lasering is not as durable, then turn around and praise lasering.
Clearly some marketing geniuses at work over at ZF!
If they are doing a trade in... perhaps we can negotiate with them to take all those lousy G80 keyboards off their hands for €.50/kg?
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- Location: Stockholm, Sweden
- DT Pro Member: 0011
Seriously... DO IT!IvanIvanovich wrote: ↑If they are doing a trade in... perhaps we can negotiate with them to take all those lousy G80 keyboards off their hands for €.50/kg?
- Daniel Beardsmore
- Location: Hertfordshire, England
- Main keyboard: Filco Majestouch 1 (home)/Poker II backlit (work)
- Main mouse: MS IMO 1.1
- Favorite switch: Probably not whatever I wrote here
- DT Pro Member: -
- Contact:
- whitecitadel
- Location: UK
- Main keyboard: Digital Membrane thingy...
- Main mouse: MS Lasermouse
- Favorite switch: TBC!
- DT Pro Member: -
But if you don't own a 250GTO, or any car, a Fiat Coupe is a great buy (as long as its the Turbo one of course, and make sure its had the cambelt changed...)
- Halvar
- Location: Baden, DE
- Main keyboard: IBM Model M SSK / Filco MT 2
- Favorite switch: Beam & buckling spring, Monterey, MX Brown
- DT Pro Member: 0051
Since this topic is coming up again for the Ping award, I'd like to add that I actually wrote a mail to Cherry/ZF about this on some bored evening months ago, and got a very nice and personal answer from their PR department.
I didn't and don't feel like translating it all to English, but I'd like to at least document it, maybe Google can help the non German speaking crowd. My mail is below their answer.
EDIT:
TÜV: German institution that checks vehicles and decides whether they can (still) participate in street traffic. Every car has to be checked by TÜV every 2 years. Also, if you tune your car you need their approval for all changes.
H-Kennzeichen: Special licence plate for vintage cars with some advantages. TÜV decides if your car can get one.
I didn't and don't feel like translating it all to English, but I'd like to at least document it, maybe Google can help the non German speaking crowd. My mail is below their answer.
He also appended a photo of his 182 VW Scirocco 53B that he mentions in the mail.Guten Tag Herr [Halvar],
vielen Dank für Ihr Feedback zu unserer Officekampagne. Wir versuchen uns natürlich ständig zu verbessern und sind deshalb sehr dankbar für Ihre Email.
Ich möchte Ihnen gerne ein paar Hintergrundinformationen geben und unsere Sicht der Dinge ein wenig erläutern. Lassen Sie mich dazu das Beispiel des VW Produktes aufgreifen.
Zunächst einmal haben wir bewusst unsere eigenen Produkte für die Kampagne verwendet, da wir natürlich unseren Wettbewerben keine Werbefläche zur Verfügung stellen wollen. Zudem gibt es bei uns die ganz klare Ausrichtung nichts Negatives über unsere Wettbewerber zu sagen. Ist nicht unser Stil.
Wir wollen mit der Kampagne natürlich nicht unsere eigenen Produkte schlecht machen, die wir seit Jahren verkaufen. Allerdings sei mir ein Vergleich aus eigener Erfahrung gestattet. Ich selbst fahre einen VW Scirocco 53B, Baujahr 1982. Somit ein klassischer Oldtimer. (Inzwischen zudem sehr selten.) Um das begehrte H-Kennzeichen zu bekommen, musste ich vergangenes Jahr zum TÜV, um nach zu weisen, dass sich das Fahrzeug im originalen, erhaltungswürdigen Zustand befindet. Kennen Sie sicherlich. Neben der Optik, spielte auch die Technik und vor allem die Abgaswerte eine entscheidende Rolle für das Bestehen der Untersuchung. Und natürlich habe ich viel Zeit und auch etwas Geld investieren müssen um die Anforderungen zu erfüllen.
Und damit zurück zu unserer Office Kampagne.
Leider gibt es für Tastaturen keinen TÜV und deshalb sind viele von ihnen sind in einem erbärmlichen Zustand. Verdreckt, abgenutzt und ungeliebt. Genau diesen Umstand wollen wir in das Bewusstsein der Nutzer bringen. Auch eine Tastatur hat Pflege und Wartung verdient. Es ist allerdings so, dass es auch hier Grenzen gibt. Sollte eine „Restauration“ den Wert des Produktes übersteigen, ist es besser es zu ersetzen. Ich hoffe Sie stimmen mir da zu. Und genau das war das Ziel der Kampagne.
Und lassen Sie mich zum Schluss noch eine Anmerkung machen:
Ich finde ein klassisches Auto auch besser als einen „Neuwagen“. Aber wenn Sie mal versucht haben, für einen Scirocco 53B bei VW Classic Parts Unterstützung zu bekommen, werden Sie sehr schnell an Ihre Grenzen stoßen. Und wenn es darum geht, Teile für einen Pierburg 2B5 Vergaser oder einen Teilekatalog zu bekommen, wird es ganz duster.
Was das Feiern unserer Firmengeschichte betrifft, gebe ich Ihnen recht, dass sollten wir auf jeden Fall tun. Allerdings wollen wir uns nicht auf unseren Erfolgen ausruhen.
Vielen Dank nochmal für Ihr Feedback,
******** *********
Elektronische Systeme/ Electronic Systems
Computereingabegeräte/Computer Input Devices
Pressestelle
ZF Friedrichshafen AG - Electronic Systems
Cherrystraße, 91275 Auerbach, Deutschland/Germany
******
______________________________
Betreff: Feedback Office Kampagne
Guten Tag,
eine kurze Rückmeldung zu Ihrer "Austauschen"-Kampagne (URL siehe oben).
Ich kann gut verstehen, dass Sie in Deutschland und weltweit Unternehmen Gründe nennen wollen, auf aktuelle Cherry-Produkte umzusteigen. Aber was haben Sie sich bloss dabei gedacht, als Beispielfoto für eine "zu laute" bzw. eine "technisch veraltete" Tastatur ausgerechnet das jahrzehntelange Flaggschiff Ihrer eigenen Firma im Bereich professioneller Tastaturen, die G80-3000, abzubilden? Die seit den 80ern bis heute ununterbrochen in Ihrem Programm ist? Die unterm Strich technisch beste Standardtastatur, die es von Cherry je gab, und deren Design es ist, das die meisten Benutzer weltweit mit Cherry-Tastaturen identifizieren?
Das ist ja in etwa so, als würde VW in Anzeigen den Käfer oder Golf I heruntermachen, um aktuelle Modelle zu verkaufen. Das würde VW nie einfallen -- im Gegenteil, die eigene Firmengeschichte wird dort regelmäßig abgefeiert. Genau dazu hätte Cherry auch allen Grund.
Wir haben in unserem Softwareentwicklungsbüro gerade erst die Gummikuppeltastaturen, die Dell mit seinen Rechnern ausliefert, komplett gegen verschiedene Schaltervarianten der G80-3000 und anderer Tastaturen mit MX-Schaltern ausgetauscht. Wunderbare Tastaturen, wenn auch die Qualität der G80-3000 nicht mehr dieselbe ist wie in den 80er und 90er-Jahren, als Tastenkappen bei Cherry noch im Doppelspritzguss hergestellt wurden und die Gehäuse noch robuster waren. Es ist schade, dass Cherry den Markt der höherwertigen mechanischen Tastaturen heutzutage kampflos Firmen wie Filco, Das, CM etc. überläßt, die gerade anfangen, auf chinesische Schaltermodule zu wechseln.
Der Gedanke, eine solche Cherry G80-3000 aus den 90ern wie abgebildet freiwillig gegen eine Gummikuppeltastatur aus Ihrem aktuellen Angebot auszutauschen, scheint mir für jeden Vielschreiber, der sich mit Tasturen auskennt, jedenfalls absurd. BIlden Sie doch eine RS6000 als abzulösendes Modell ab, dann versteht jeder den nötigen Wechsel. Und schlagen Sie eine mechanische Tastatur wie die aktuellen MX-Reihen ruhig auch für professionelle Anwender vor statt ultraflacher Apple-Imitate mit Chiclet-Kappen.
Illustrationen und weitere Meinungen zu Ihrer Kampagne finden Sie in diesem Thread in unserem Tastaturenforum deskthority.net:
http://deskthority.net/keyboards-f2/che ... t8351.html
Viele Grüße,
[Halvar]
EDIT:
TÜV: German institution that checks vehicles and decides whether they can (still) participate in street traffic. Every car has to be checked by TÜV every 2 years. Also, if you tune your car you need their approval for all changes.
H-Kennzeichen: Special licence plate for vintage cars with some advantages. TÜV decides if your car can get one.
Last edited by Halvar on 03 Dec 2014, 10:36, edited 1 time in total.
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- Location: geekhack ergonomics subforum
- Favorite switch: Alps plate spring; clicky SMK
- DT Pro Member: -
Close to Google Translate version:
He’s trying hard, but the marketing campaign is still a steaming turd.
Also, Cherry’s keyboard division has been resting on their laurels for nearly 20 years.
Sorry, but a dirty, tired, unloved classic keyboard is way nicer than the crappy rubber dome. In most cases, the maintenance required is dunking the keycaps in some detergent for a few minutes, and blasting the rest with a Datavac. Nothing that takes a mechanic or costs anything close to the cost of full replacement.Halvar wrote: ↑Unfortunately, there is no TÜV for keyboards and so many of them are in a sorry state. Dirty, tired and unloved. This is precisely the fact we want to bring to the attention of users. A keyboard deserves care and maintenance. It is, however, so that there are limits here as well. If a "restoration" exceed the value of the product, it is better to replace it. I hope you agree with me there. And that was the goal of the campaign.
[...] As for celebrating our history, I agree with you that we should definitely do it. However, we are not resting on our laurels.
He’s trying hard, but the marketing campaign is still a steaming turd.
Also, Cherry’s keyboard division has been resting on their laurels for nearly 20 years.
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- Location: Germany
- Main keyboard: IBM Model M | G80-3000LQCDE | Tt Meka G1 MX-Black
- Main mouse: Sensei
- Favorite switch: MX-Clear | Buckling spring
- DT Pro Member: -
Another addition to Halvars' answer he got from Cherry:
H-Kennzeichen - It's a special car plate, that you can get by the TUV. It's used for oldtimers (20+ yrs) additionally to the age the car has to be in the original (or as close to as possible) state. Repairs have to be done using original parts and so on.
If you can get such a sign you have to pay less taxes overall (for particle dust for example).
H-Kennzeichen - It's a special car plate, that you can get by the TUV. It's used for oldtimers (20+ yrs) additionally to the age the car has to be in the original (or as close to as possible) state. Repairs have to be done using original parts and so on.
If you can get such a sign you have to pay less taxes overall (for particle dust for example).
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- DT Pro Member: -
I'm not really a Cherry fan, but that page made me angry. It's standard marketing bullshit designed to get people to trash perfectly useable things and replace them with inferior modern crap. The whole "disposible society" thing makes me sick. I prefer to buy quality and keep it forever.Halvar wrote: ↑Cherry now tells you to get rid of your old G80 and buy some new crap every few months instead:
http://www.cherry.de/exchange/
Nice.Kurk wrote: ↑I took the freedom to express my feelings about Cherry's suggestions in this skillfully crafted collage:
- 7bit
- Location: Berlin, DE
- Main keyboard: Tipro / IBM 3270 emulator
- Main mouse: Logitech granite for SGI
- Favorite switch: MX Lock
- DT Pro Member: 0001
They do this to be able to sell more switches to me. If they can avoid MX switches in their own products, delivery times go down by 15%.
They have no other choice!
They have no other choice!
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- Main keyboard: CM Storm Quickfire Rapid (MX Red)
- Main mouse: Logitech G502
- Favorite switch: Buckling Springs
- DT Pro Member: -
...
- Attachments
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- Dog glare.jpg (295.04 KiB) Viewed 6901 times