Another viable ALPS keycap choice?

joebeazelman · 31 Jan 2022, 09:35

As Alps aficionados know, Cherry MX crowd has some enviable customization options. While quite a bit of it is just garish gimmickry, there is no denying the countless array of keycap choices available in all colors, materials, and profiles to fit every budget.

Replacing a stock set of Alps keycaps requires a lot of creativity, perseverance, finances, luck, and irreverence for historical items. It's not uncommon to poach keycaps from several perfectly working vintage computers, leaving dismembered carcasses to be bemoaned by vintage computing collectors. There have been attempts, both commercial and DIY, to bring Cherry keycaps over to ALPS, but they have been less than ideal.

I came across an interesting MX keycap set which, if nothing else, offers at least another choice. The Skyloong keycap set is made of silicone and ABS with a profile similar to SA switches.

Spoiler:

The most interesting part is its two-piece keycap: an ABS insert that snaps onto the stem and also into the silicone cap. It’s not unlike the two-piece keycaps found on Model M keyboards.

Spoiler:

It is possible to 3D print replacement inserts with ALPS mounts instead of MX mounts. The resulting part can be epoxied in place, allowing for a single unit size to cover the entire range of keycaps sizes. It might be possible to core the stem out of a less desirable keycap using a small hole saw turning it into a stud.

Muirium · 31 Jan 2022, 09:51

The problem with existing adapters is they ride too high:

viewtopic.php?p=194579#p194579

And what exactly do you do about stabilisers? It’s fun to try, but no way to live. Kludge kludge kludge!

As for the design you’re sharing: better, but still needs stabbed properly. Could be feasible however.

joebeazelman · 31 Jan 2022, 18:14

I'm not sure what the issue is with the stabs, but if it's the actual wire, it should be straightforward to bend one into shape. I have special jewelers pliers designed for this purpose. You can also make a bending fixture using a block of wood and a few nails in various diameters for the bending posts.

hellothere · 31 Jan 2022, 23:42

I agree stabilizers could be a problem, but how much of a problem is going to be dependent on which KB you have. I think the bigger problem that the bottom row isn't very standardized on Alps keyboards and that the 2.25u (or whatever it is in that set) Enter key rarely also comes with a 2u (or whatever it is) Backspace. That being said, I'd still be interested in getting 3d printed Alps mounts for use with the Skylooooooooong caps. In other words, "Shut up and take my money!"

Muirium · 01 Feb 2022, 01:33

Alps often have finicky stab clips which insert into the caps. I find Costar stabs irritating on MX, let alone Alps' own. Don't even get me started on Alps double-stabbed Big Ass Returns!

wiki/Zenith_Supersport_SX#Gallery

Notice how close the wire stabilisers fit with the plastic of the caps? How well is that going to work with two-piece caps?

Sure, it's an Alps integrated dome keyboard, not SKCM. But it comes to mind because it's legit Alps-made, and that very key gives me nightmares!

Polecat · 01 Feb 2022, 05:19

Muirium wrote: ↑
01 Feb 2022, 01:33
Alps often have finicky stab clips which insert into the caps. I find Costar stabs irritating on MX, let alone Alps' own. Don't even get me started on Alps double-stabbed Big Ass Returns!

Notice how close the wire stabilisers fit with the plastic of the caps? How well is that going to work with two-piece caps?

Sure, it's an Alps integrated dome keyboard, not SKCM. But it comes to mind because it's legit Alps-made, and that very key gives me nightmares!

Just last night I managed to fix the sticky Big Ass Return (not Enter!) key on my just-arrived-from-Japan MacOS keyboard. Alps SKBM (pingy!) with two Costar-style stabs *and* a finicky case design that I would have never gotten apart and back together again without help from the nice folks here. Maybe it's just me, or perhaps the three Tall Boys I just downed, but it seems like the life has come back to DT!

Palatino · 01 Feb 2022, 23:44

Agreed! After a prolonged period of mush, the fall of the Kingdom of Spamalot is a genuine tactile event.

joebeazelman · 04 Feb 2022, 19:50

hellothere wrote: ↑
31 Jan 2022, 23:42
I agree stabilizers could be a problem, but how much of a problem is going to be dependent on which KB you have. I think the bigger problem that the bottom row isn't very standardized on Alps keyboards and that the 2.25u (or whatever it is in that set) Enter key rarely also comes with a 2u (or whatever it is) Backspace. That being said, I'd still be interested in getting 3d printed Alps mounts for use with the Skylooooooooong caps. In other words, "Shut up and take my money!"

It does sound interesting, but I've never tried silicone keycaps before. It might add another dimension to the typing experience, a gentle rubbery mush when hitting a hard bottom.

I want to reiterate and clarify the alternative to 3D printing I suggested; it might be more economical and possibly more durable to salvage the mounts from a set of less than desirable keycaps. This would entail "coring" out the small area where the mount is located, leaving a stud which can be adhered to the insert using epoxy. The coring can be done with a dremel leaving the mount and a perimeter of plastic around it. It might be too proud or not flat enough (curvature of the keycap), but sanding the mating area of the stud should fix it. The height of the stud should be measured using a cheap caliper to insure a uniform height for all the caps.

thefarside · 07 Feb 2022, 21:49

I stumbled upon this DCS Alps WoB interest check yesterday and hope it pans out:
https://www.reddit.com/r/mechmarket/com ... wob_update

Sadly no big ass enter is included.

hellothere · 07 Feb 2022, 22:39

https://shop.tai-hao.com/products/alps-capslock $3.60.
(Yes, I know the link says "capslock." It's for both Caps Lock and Enter keys.)

thefarside · 08 Feb 2022, 00:34

hellothere wrote: ↑
07 Feb 2022, 22:39
https://shop.tai-hao.com/products/alps-capslock $3.60.
(Yes, I know the link says "capslock." It's for both Caps Lock and Enter keys.)

Perfect thanks!

hellothere · 08 Feb 2022, 17:29

You're welcome.

Sometime in the future, I want to get this set from Tai-Hao and I'll probably order multiple caps lock and enter keys. Tai-Hao also has some colorful 1.25U blank keys that I wouldn't mind a few of.

thefarside · 19 Feb 2022, 03:03

hellothere wrote: ↑
08 Feb 2022, 17:29
You're welcome.

Sometime in the future, I want to get this set from Tai-Hao and I'll probably order multiple caps lock and enter keys. Tai-Hao also has some colorful 1.25U blank keys that I wouldn't mind a few of.

I purchased a set from the link you shared. They have nice caps! Below are pics of the set and the bonus gifts they include in the order. Overall the keys look great and I’d recommend them. The only issue for me is the Focus layout uses a split tight shift with the \ key and the set didn’t include keys for that, but I’ll work something out.

Key set:

: Key caps; 1C4C5B99-A6A7-4248-8078-8B1CCB248D20.jpeg (2.27 MiB) Viewed 6470 times

Bonus gifts. A blue alps clone and some blank alps keys on the left side and cherry mount dice keys on the right side:

: Bonus gifts; F2002D83-2551-4204-B80E-B4AE7B174A5B.jpeg (1.98 MiB) Viewed 6470 times

Polecat · 19 Feb 2022, 06:46

Thank you for the heads-up about TaiHao now selling the Alps BAE Enter keys. They're really a first class outfit. I bought a handful of the offset CapsLock caps a while back, and they were in my hands (along with bonus gifts) from Taiwan to California in three days. Impressive. I've also bought a few sets of their caps from resellers, but I'll be buying direct in the future whenever possible.

hellothere · 21 Feb 2022, 15:54

thefarside wrote: ↑
19 Feb 2022, 03:03
I purchased a set from the link you shared. They have nice caps! Below are pics of the set and the bonus gifts they include in the order. Overall the keys look great and I’d recommend them. The only issue for me is the Focus layout uses a split tight shift with the \ key and the set didn’t include keys for that, but I’ll work something out.

Key set:
1C4C5B99-A6A7-4248-8078-8B1CCB248D20.jpeg

When I saw this, II thought, "Why does thefarside's keyboard have so much space between the keys?" They're still in the box. Duh.

hellothere · 21 Feb 2022, 15:56

Oh. One other comment. I've bought a couple Alps key sets from Tai-Hao and the "extras" were MX mount.