Let's create the FSSK/FEXT = DONE !!!!

idollar
i$

14 Apr 2016, 19:43

alh84001 has proposed to check if we could create a PCB for the 73X38xx, 09F4230 boards here -> post300979.html#p300979

I think that it is worth reviewing it and check if the effort would pay off.

Does anyone knows where can one find pictures of the internals of one of these ?
Or even better, where to get one at a decent price ?

User avatar
Scarpia

14 Apr 2016, 19:53

There's one on recycledgoods for around $60 if I remember correctly.

User avatar
alh84001
v.001

14 Apr 2016, 21:15

Quoting wcass here
wcass wrote: IIRC, the non-F unsavers are NOT Model M unsavers.
Trying to convert it to an F would be like trying to convert a Logitech to an F.

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=7377.0
True. They were not even built by IBM. However, and forgive me if I'm talking out of my a$$ here, but they seem to share the same broad build-style:
1. curved plates
2. top plastic plate
3. back metal plate

I've never seen one live, let alone handled it, so I don't know the feel of these plates, their thickness and so on, so I will let someone else chime in on this.

Now, I realize that FSSK only requires PCB and controller (and as I'm in the middle of getting stuff for the XTant, I sometimes get these two kind of mixed up in my head), but still, just as a thought experiment, would it be possible to convert non-F unsavers to F a-la XTant? Would anything else be needed except top plate and PCB? Could a M122 top plate be adapted for use here?

User avatar
alh84001
v.001

14 Apr 2016, 21:18

Scarpia wrote: There's one on recycledgoods for around $60 if I remember correctly.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/IBM-73X3832-Key ... OSwhcJWQ58~
http://www.ebay.com/itm/IBM-09F4230-TYP ... SwAuNW5ukt

Quite expensive.

User avatar
Redmaus
Gotta start somewhere

14 Apr 2016, 21:20

I have one. Whatever measurements you need I can provide.

I got it so I might be able to use it as an extra case for the unsaver, but I think it's too small.

I still think I am gonna cut my OG case, but if I find an alternative I will use that instead.

User avatar
fohat
Elder Messenger

14 Apr 2016, 21:25

I have a Model F "Unsaver" but the sticker on the back says "Model M" and it is dated 1996.

My guess is that it was serviced or refurbished at that time, stickered with a "for-IBM-by-Lexmark" sticker, and resold or sent back to its regular owner.
Attachments
F-unsaver-2016-label (Medium).JPG
F-unsaver-2016-label (Medium).JPG (119.64 KiB) Viewed 1763 times
F-unsaver-2016-rear (Medium).JPG
F-unsaver-2016-rear (Medium).JPG (143.22 KiB) Viewed 1763 times

User avatar
Redmaus
Gotta start somewhere

14 Apr 2016, 21:29

You have an Unsaver Fohat???? :shock:

Wow nice! You have the regular version with cable, I think mine is the CAD one. I have the CAD Unsaver and the rubberdome one discussed above.

Have you converted it yet?

User avatar
fohat
Elder Messenger

14 Apr 2016, 21:39

Redmaus wrote:
Have you converted it yet?

I did the ANSI mod and added 3 bolts to firm up the action but I left the original controller and cable in place.

After installing a few internal Teensies, I usually just plug them into an outboard converter these days.

User avatar
wcass

14 Apr 2016, 21:41

Redmaus wrote: I have one. Whatever measurements you need I can provide.

I got it so I might be able to use it as an extra case for the unsaver, but I think it's too small.

I still think I am gonna cut my OG case, but if I find an alternative I will use that instead.
These 3 would help:

Thickness of the plate assembly (bottom plate - top plate inclusive)
height of switch + cap (bottom plate - top of cap inclusive)
front "lip" of switch (distance from front edge of spacebar cap to front edge of top plate)

User avatar
Redmaus
Gotta start somewhere

14 Apr 2016, 21:43

Should I be using calipers or something to measure?

idollar
i$

14 Apr 2016, 22:20

wcass wrote:
Redmaus wrote: I have one. Whatever measurements you need I can provide.

I got it so I might be able to use it as an extra case for the unsaver, but I think it's too small.

I still think I am gonna cut my OG case, but if I find an alternative I will use that instead.
These 3 would help:

Thickness of the plate assembly (bottom plate - top plate inclusive)
height of switch + cap (bottom plate - top of cap inclusive)
front "lip" of switch (distance from front edge of spacebar cap to front edge of top plate)
And any information about the hole for the switch
We could try to take all the switches away and replace them with barrels ....

Image

User avatar
wcass

16 Apr 2016, 02:39

Redmaus wrote: Should I be using calipers or something to measure?
Yeah, that would be best. If you don't already have one, consider getting a cheap one (under $5). We don't need high accuracy.

idollar
i$

17 Apr 2016, 14:43

I have decided to open the FSSK v1.00 users manual: FSSK v1.00 - Installation & Users Manual :D

User avatar
Hypersphere

08 May 2016, 19:08

Thanks for posting the FSSK v 1.00 User's Manual! This is greatly appreciated! Nice work.

For now, a couple of things occurred to me:

1. It seems like there ought to be a way to get a rubber mat to work in the FSSK, but I have not tried this yet.

2. Is it necessary to heat-bend the PCB, or could it be installed onto the curved plate without pre-bending?

User avatar
need

08 May 2016, 19:46

Hypersphere wrote: Thanks for posting the FSSK v 1.00 User's Manual! This is greatly appreciated! Nice work.

For now, a couple of things occurred to me:

1. It seems like there ought to be a way to get a rubber mat to work in the FSSK, but I have not tried this yet.

2. Is it necessary to heat-bend the PCB, or could it be installed onto the curved plate without pre-bending?
from my memory someone did it without bending the PCB

idollar
i$

08 May 2016, 20:52

Hypersphere wrote: Thanks for posting the FSSK v 1.00 User's Manual! This is greatly appreciated! Nice work.

For now, a couple of things occurred to me:

1. It seems like there ought to be a way to get a rubber mat to work in the FSSK, but I have not tried this yet.
My experience is that with the rubber mat between the flippers and the PCB one will get problems in registering the keys.
This is due to the uneven distribution of pressure across the board


2. Is it necessary to heat-bend the PCB, or could it be installed onto the curved plate without pre-bending?
I have not tried to mount an FSSK without bending the PCB.
The force that the PCB would do, would be to high for the plastic barrel plate. I would not recommend to test the FSSK if the PCB is not curved first.

idollar
i$

21 May 2016, 17:36

I have a working FEXT prototype without any problem !!!

As it should be, I am typing this post with the first of the FEXT, based on the PCB v1.00b with the XMIT keys (which I have not tested as I do not feel like breaking the case that I have)

I will post this in various threads where the PCB is discussed.
Last edited by idollar on 21 May 2016, 21:47, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Halvar

21 May 2016, 19:59

That's brilliant news! I'm in the middle of building mine, but can't do any more today. I was confident that you would have no errors in the design, but with the capacitive sensing, you never know what happens. So it's good to know you built it with success.

idollar
i$

21 May 2016, 21:56

Halvar wrote: That's brilliant news! I'm in the middle of building mine, but can't do any more today. I was confident that you would have no errors in the design, but with the capacitive sensing, you never know what happens. So it's good to know you built it with success.
Thank you Halvar, It is very kind of you. This PCB was redesign to accommodate what I call the XMIT Keys. These are between the ALT and the Control Keys. To use them, one has to cut the case and somehow insert a barrel in the middle.
I think I will not do it. My boards are too good to break them :-)

I am typing with it. Still adjusting the threshold. The autocalibration reports 132. I am using 130 without problems.

User avatar
tentator

31 May 2016, 09:31

as said i$ in the other thread, i will then first start converting my unicomp to model f with your pcb for FEXT. If you already have one I could happily test for you the xmit keys since the unicomp already has the barrels for those keys there :)
I can receive post in germany so to reduce shipping and time, just let me know.
I think I'll do this first and then at a later point think after learning this process how to do, if at all, something like an FUNSAVER (nice name eh? :)) starting from an M122 and chopping the numpad (Actually what could be done is to reuse the case from a rubber dome unsaver and cut only the barrel plate of the m122, the pcb should then be already of correct size).. yes still dreaming, but let's do it one step at a time ;)

tent:wq

User avatar
alh84001
v.001

31 May 2016, 11:53

I see I'm not alone in thinking about the rubberdome unsaver. @tentator keep in mind that they are extremely hard to find in Europe

Abby

11 Jun 2019, 12:46

It feels so cool, I look forward to your continuous update.

wyatt8740

03 Jul 2019, 05:24

idollar wrote:
16 Jan 2016, 09:45
Here are the very final files that I have sent to "pcbway".
I just hope that they used this version that I submitted via email after the order was made, I added some instructions in the bottom silk layer to clarify that the pads were only in the connector.

The zip contains the deltacad, diptrace and final gerber files.
...where is the zip?

Post Reply

Return to “Workshop”