deskthority

Posted: **17 Dec 2016, 03:02**

Yes, controller will hang from the matrix PCB by the connector. I had room for the holes, they were there already, so i left them. One of my favorite sayings is "better to have and not need than need and not have." If anyone suspects a grounding issue, just connect a sturdy wire right there.

Posted: **17 Dec 2016, 03:08**

DMA wrote: why the components are placed at such odd angles? Is it.. *gasp* hand-soldered??

It is hand soldered... Was one on the prototypes Phosphorglow put together earlier when doing Ellipse's project. Sent to me to test with. Works...

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 04:47**

I built some LED boards using through hole LEDs and resistors to see how the different color LEDs will look. I ordered green, amber, red, blue, white - these are pretty much all of the common colors. I don't have a FExt yet, so used a stand-in-PCB for the test. First up is green LEDs:

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Next up is white LEDs.

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This gave me an idea ... could i use light gels to change the color? I ordered some cheap speedlight gells off of eBay - 12 colors for $2.

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The gels are just a few mil thick and can easily be cut to small rectangles to fit over the LED windows (between the overlay and the case). Setting the color this way offers more color options, allows you to change your color choice, and looks nice.

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 08:56**

Ooh, that's really interesting! Does this mean white LEDs + optional gel overlays might be in play for the current MF group buy, or are you just experimenting for future incarnations?

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 09:19**

green! forever!

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 09:22**

Or white + green gel overlay?

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 09:26**

pure GREEN! I want no lame gel overlay!

Spoiler:

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 10:34**

I think I'd do blue.
Do those gel overlays dim the LEDs much?

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 16:22**

Techno Trousers wrote: Ooh, that's really interesting! Does this mean white LEDs + optional gel overlays might be in play for the current MF group buy, or are you just experimenting for future incarnations?

It might be. I'm finishing up the other LED colors and will send all to lot_lizard for evaluation - he will make the call. I know that he wants to make available a complete kit, but many probably want different LED configurations - color, brightness, old/new placement. My first choice would be full on custom - you tell us what you want and we will give you that - but this would be the highest cost option. Another option would be to give you the wires, LEDs, resistors, PCB, let you choose which to use and solder up your own - but not everyone has an iron and those skills. A good compromise might be to offer choice between option 2 (just parts) or pre-assembled white LEDs (old placement) with gel strips. If you have a new-style case (different LED placement) or didn't want to use the gels, you would need the "just parts" option.

Ir0n wrote: I think I'd do blue.
Do those gel overlays dim the LEDs much?

They do dim the light some (dark colors dim more than the lighter ones). The pack i have has multiple shades per color - two or three reds, ambers, greens, blues, purples. Another way to edit the brightness is to change the resistor - higher resistance lowers the current and the LED gets dimmer. I'll share the algorithm with anyone that wants it.

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 19:44**

Wcass, can you post pictures of the "real" green side by side with whites covered with a green gel and the overlay, so we can compare directly? I'm thinking that if the gel version looks the same, or very close, maybe that would help Matt3o and anyone else with reservations to accept it as a viable option.

I do think that would be the lowest cost, most flexible option for everyone, if it's acceptable.

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 21:47**

Unfortunately, i only have one xwhatsit, ordered just 3 of each color LED, and i don't want to desolder a board just to mix green and white. I think lot_lizard has more than one controller, so he could probably get that picture.

FYI, if you want to make your own, i have attached gerbers to this post. The one PCB is good for both "new" and "old" style cases - populate one side or the other.

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Get 3 PCBs made by OskPark for $4 and you can order 12" 4-wire female Dupont jumper, 3 LEDs and resistors from Digikey, Mouser, or eBay for about $2 plus shipping. Most helpful to have the spec sheet for the LEDs to calculate the resistor value for 15 to 20 mcd.

For example, the white LED i used is http://www.digikey.com/products/en?keywords=365-1467-ND
The important info is ... it gives 6200 mcd @ 20 mA and has a voltage drop of 3.2 V. Because the relationship between current (mA) and brightness (mcd) is essentially linear, you can calculate the needed current for a specific brightness. To get 15 mcd from this LED, i know that i need to drive it with 0.048 mA ...

15 mcd x (20 mA / 6200 mcd) = 0.048 mA

Take that value and go to your favorite LED calculator like this one and you get your resistor value - 39k ohms (xwhatsit controller is 5 V power source).

Posted: **31 Dec 2016, 22:52**

wcass wrote:Unfortunately, i only have one xwhatsit, ordered just 3 of each color LED, and i don't want to desolder a board just to mix green and white. I think lot_lizard has more than one controller, so he could probably get that picture.

Thanks for the info, that's great!

I saw you had a picture of the green LEDs with the overlay. If you still have the white LEDs installed, could you take a picture of them with green gel under the overlay? Then we could compare how they look (two different pictures, but they should be mostly comparable).

Posted: **01 Jan 2017, 00:55**

Sure. I just finished soldering up the amber and red LEDs. Blue next and then some gel on white pictures.

Posted: **01 Jan 2017, 04:47**

The quick answer is ... gels look just as good as LEDs. The gels in these pictures are about 20% dimmer than the LEDs without gels, but that is easily fixed. The only gel that did not look as expected was purple - which just looked like slightly dimmer white to me.

The color rendering on my camera apparently sucks. IRL, reds look red and blues look blue (nothing like these pictures). Amber and green look similar to the pictures.
Amber gel

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Amber LED

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Blue gel

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Blue LED

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Green gel

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Green LED

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Pink gel

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Purple gel

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Red gel

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Red LED

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White LED

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Posted: **01 Jan 2017, 04:59**

The gels don't look bad at all!
Thanks wcass.

Posted: **01 Jan 2017, 05:06**

I agree, those look great! I don't know about anyone else, but I'm all in favor of the white LED + gel option.

Posted: **01 Jan 2017, 13:13**

wcass wrote: FYI, if you want to make your own, i have attached gerbers to this post. The one PCB is good for both "new" and "old" style cases - populate one side or the other.

You really have done such an awesome job of making each of these components "multi-use" and easily interchangeable. From the LED gels, to the LED PCB, to the USB daughter boards, to the triomate connectors on the PCB/xWhatsit. Kudos to always having that in the forefront of your thought process (engineer at work). It's these steps that turn a "tinker toy" into a real product imo.

Posted: **01 Jan 2017, 15:54**

wcass wrote: The quick answer is ... gels look just as good as LEDs. The gels in these pictures are about 20% dimmer than the LEDs without gels, but that is easily fixed. The only gel that did not look as expected was purple - which just looked like slightly dimmer white to me.

The color rendering on my camera apparently sucks. IRL, reds look red and blues look blue (nothing like these pictures). Amber and green look similar to the pictures.

Oh man, I've never realized how much I wanted amber LEDs in an industrial grey chassis. Wcass, if I may ask, where'd you buy the amber ones from?

EDIT: Nevermind, it was most likely digikey, I'll just buy a sample of amber LEDs from a bunch of OEMs until I find which one is my favourite.

Posted: **01 Jan 2017, 16:05**

wcass wrote:Unfortunately, i only have one xwhatsit, ordered just 3 of each color LED, and i don't want to desolder a board just to mix green and white. I think lot_lizard has more than one controller, so he could probably get that picture.

FYI, if you want to make your own, i have attached gerbers to this post. The one PCB is good for both "new" and "old" style cases - populate one side or the other.
untitled.JPG
Get 3 PCBs made by OskPark for $4 and you can order 12" 4-wire female Dupont jumper, 3 LEDs and resistors from Digikey, Mouser, or eBay for about $2 plus shipping. Most helpful to have the spec sheet for the LEDs to calculate the resistor value for 15 to 20 mcd.

For example, the white LED i used is http://www.digikey.com/products/en?keywords=365-1467-ND
The important info is ... it gives 6200 mcd @ 20 mA and has a voltage drop of 3.2 V. Because the relationship between current (mA) and brightness (mcd) is essentially linear, you can calculate the needed current for a specific brightness. To get 15 mcd from this LED, i know that i need to drive it with 0.048 mA ...

15 mcd x (20 mA / 6200 mcd) = 0.048 mA

Take that value and go to your favorite LED calculator like this one and you get your resistor value - 39k ohms (xwhatsit controller is 5 V power source).

Awesome! Thanks!

Posted: **01 Jan 2017, 16:12**

micrex22 wrote: Oh man, I've never realized how much I wanted amber LEDs in an industrial grey chassis

My opinion as well. Prefer green on ivory, amber on indy.

I'm still a fan of the LED overlay giokkkk dug up. I reached out to someone in Minneapolis about a quote for say 50 of them, and never heard back. I will reach out to him again.

Posted: **01 Jan 2017, 16:38**

The vendors often call them "yellow" - at high brightness they look more yellow, but at 20 mcd they look amber to me. The specific LEDs i used are:
OVLBR4C7 = red, 2 v, 3700 mcd @ 20 mA
OVLBY4C7 = yellow, 2 v, 3700 mcd @ 20 mA
OVLBB4C7 = blue, 3.2 v, 1800 mcd @ 20 mA
OVLBG4C7 = green, 3.2 v, 8400 mcd @ 20 mA
OVLAW4CB7 = white, 3.2 v, 6200 mcd @ 20 mA

The calculated resistors values to get about 20 mcd for these specific LEDs are 33 k for red, yellow, white; 39 k for green and 8.2 k for blue. My eye says that blue, green, and white are too bright at these values and need more resistance. I tried blue at 33 k and it looked better, but 15 k is probably just right. Green should probably go to 47 k, and white to 39 k (this i used on my test boards) - but if one is using a gel, you loose some brightness, so 33 k for white is probably just right.

Posted: **02 Jan 2017, 23:32**

omg that "Purple gel" looks so cute!!

definitely would like this...

Posted: **05 Jan 2017, 03:09**

How about traffic light scheme like this one:

Posted: **05 Jan 2017, 03:38**

Mr.Nobody wrote: How about traffic light scheme like this one:

That should be pretty easy to do with the gel option--the only issue would be if you'd need a different brightness value for each of the LEDs so they appear the same brightness through the different gel colors. I don't think you would have to worry about that, though, based on wcass' experiments.

I admit, I was considering doing Red, White, and Blue for my gel colors, but I'm not feeling super patriotic at the moment.

Of course, if I change my mind later, it'll be simple to switch gels!

Posted: **05 Jan 2017, 03:47**

lot_lizard wrote:
micrex22 wrote: I'm still a fan of the LED overlay giokkkk dug up. I reached out to someone in Minneapolis about a quote for say 50 of them, and never heard back. I will reach out to him again.

Just for curiosity's sake... The image link isn't loading for me, and I couldn't find it in giokkk's post history. Do you have a picture you can show? I really like the traditional pebble overlay with LEDs at the bottom, but I'm not averse to other options, if they're viable!

Posted: **05 Jan 2017, 04:23**

Techno Trousers wrote: Just for curiosity's sake... The image link isn't loading for me, and I couldn't find it in giokkk's post history. Do you have a picture you can show? I really like the traditional pebble overlay with LEDs at the bottom, but I'm not averse to other options, if they're viable!

Just to verify, this image isn't visible?

Posted: **05 Jan 2017, 04:26**

Information
The selected attachment does not exist anymore.

Posted: **05 Jan 2017, 04:32**

wcass wrote:
Information
The selected attachment does not exist anymore.

Ah... he sent it to me in a PM and I just linked the image URL. We have better security here than I expected (assumed security by obscurity for images/uploads).

This was it...

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Posted: **05 Jan 2017, 04:37**

That M13-style overlay looks pretty spiffy on the industrial case.

It looks like the same overlay on the M13 too, did giokkkk use a graphic or template to have it made?

Posted: **05 Jan 2017, 05:05**

emdude wrote: That M13-style overlay looks pretty spiffy on the industrial case.

It looks like the same overlay on the M13 too, did giokkkk use a graphic or template to have it made?

Agreed... I think he found the picture somewhere, along with a link to Webwit's stash at one point at least

deskthority

(Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

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