Cherry B65 46AB keyboard mechanism

snuci · 19 Jun 2017, 02:44

Not sure if I have the exact details right so I have not yet updated the wiki page on this one. This is a Cherry B65 46AB keyboard mechanism with T shaped Cherry key switches and Cherry key caps. This keyboard also have half sized key caps for function keys and different key switch for the space bar. This keyboard mechanism is a little bit dirty but you can see, what looks like, dried lube on the key switches.

Here are some pics from the wiki page here: wiki/Cherry_B65_46AB

If someone can identify the key switches and any other details, I'd appreciate it.

Daniel Beardsmore · 19 Jun 2017, 09:55

Off-hand I don't know if that should be "B65-46AB" keyboard mechanism with a hyphen.

Those look like the old-style switches (style A), so I guess it's M61-0100 (straight) and M61-0120 (tee). Those seemed to be the standard types. I don't know if the redesign corresponded with the new part numbers or whether those two changes occurred separately.

snuci · 19 Jun 2017, 12:58

The key switches on Seebart's Hal KB2100 seem to be the later style as the key switch top cover (at least) is different. It's missing (what I still maintain is) the key cap stops, has the newer logo and has a ridge that goes around the key stem. I wonder if the HAL key switches are shorter? I may have a keyboard with these newer "T" key switches. If I do, I'll have to compare. I am curious if the key caps bottom out on that ridge.

seebart · 19 Jun 2017, 13:02

snuci wrote: The key switches on Seebart's Hal KB2100 seem to be the later style as the key switch top cover (at least) is different. It's missing (what I still maintain is) the key cap stops, has the newer logo and has a ridge that goes around the key stem.

Certain aspects of the switch do look similair. The spacebar mechanism looks very similair though.

snuci wrote: I wonder if the HAL key switches are shorter? I may have a keyboard with these newer "T" key switches. If I do, I'll have to compare. I am curious if the key caps bottom out on that ridge.

I can measure the switch if you like? I'll have a look about bottom out.

Daniel Beardsmore · 19 Jun 2017, 19:09

The HAL KB is dated 11/81, which is consistent with the CDC IST II keyboard from ca. 1981 that uses the same switches (just without the extra digits in the mould). 1981 is in between the last known date for M61-0120 (1979) and the first known date for M73-0120 (1982).

The HAL KB keycaps appear to be Comptec, based on the internal design and the typeface. Interestingly, the moulds are different to those used for the BBC Micro, being cut with a finer cutter, and with a few differences in the typography (apostrophe and braces in particular).

It's curious then that the HAL space bar only accepts a bar mount keystem; you'd think Comptec wouldn't repeat the bizarre requirement of space needing a different switch, but maybe the change of mount is a weird way to indicate that the space bar switch is a different weighting.

I notice that snuci's is US-made, which raises the question of whether Cherry shipped all the tooling across the Atlantic, or had it recreated in Germany. Recreated tooling could account for the changes in the design and part numbers. The 1982 catalogue has Germany at the top of the list of manufacturing sites, but the Illinois site is still shown.

snuci · 19 Jun 2017, 19:39

Found the pics I sent you (Daniel) some time back of the Cherry Tektronix board. Looks to be like Seebart's but from 1979. This appears to be the "hole-y" version and have the old Cherry logo still

I still have to take more pics of this board.

: Cherry T - top; Cherry T - top.JPG (259.83 KiB) Viewed 2473 times

: Cherry T - bottom; Cherry T -bottom.JPG (167.6 KiB) Viewed 2473 times

: Cherry T - logo; Cherry T - logo.JPG (144.34 KiB) Viewed 2473 times

: Cherry T - mount; Cherry T - mount.JPG (216.58 KiB) Viewed 2473 times

: Cherry T - PCB 14th week 1979; Cherry T - PCB 14th week 1979.JPG (234.81 KiB) Viewed 2473 times

: Cherry T - plate mount locking; Cherry T - plate mount locking.JPG (202.17 KiB) Viewed 2473 times

: Cherry Crosspoint - plate mount non-locking; Cherry Crosspoint - plate mount non-locking.JPG (207.54 KiB) Viewed 2473 times

: Cherry T - space bar; Cherry T - space bar.JPG (205.14 KiB) Viewed 2473 times

: Cherry T - key cap; Cherry T - key cap.JPG (152.87 KiB) Viewed 2473 times

zslane · 19 Jun 2017, 21:07

Forget the dang switches, just look at those glorious spherical double-shot keycaps!

It's such a shame that GMK didn't replicate those molds too...

Nuum · 19 Jun 2017, 21:39

I seem to recall that they still have the molds for those keycaps but they don't fit "modern" MX switches anyway.

Daniel Beardsmore · 30 Jun 2017, 09:58

snuci wrote: It's missing (what I still maintain is) the key cap stops, has the newer logo and has a ridge that goes around the key stem.

The 1973 catalogue shows how illumination works. The lamp is fitted onto a PCB, and that is placed over the switch. The diagram is unclear, but you can see that the lamp positions—one either side—correspond with those posts. There's a suggestion that the posts may even secure the PCB.

The diagram isn't hugely clear, and this design seemed to get replaced. None of the diagrams in the catalogues are very clear. In the 1982 catalogue the little stubs are still clearly depicted (with centre marks) even though they surely can't be of any use any more.

: 1973 catalogue: Cherry gold crosspoint switch illumination option; lamp fitting.jpg (127.21 KiB) Viewed 2381 times

(Interestingly, the plate is specified as aluminium instead of steel.)

This is another possible option:

http://www.google.com/patents/US3849621

It's not clear if that's the same series.