Picture request - Pine SKCM Black gutts

Lynx_Carpathica · 05 Feb 2021, 10:42

Hi there
I need some picture to make understanding the Alps timeline a bit more. The wiki is also a bit weak regarding SKCM Blacks, especially the pine variety.
What pics do I need?
A picture of an early pine Black switch, specifically the tactile leaf, from multiple angles. I want to compare them with Salmon alps.
A late pine might come in handy as well. Who knows how many versions it has...
My theory based on the SKCM Ivories are: Pine blacks came after Salmons while retaining the same tactile leaf and possibly using different plastics for the sliders. This is the theory I want to either proove, or disproove.
The best would be similar comparisons to this (this pic was uploaded by me to the wiki)

I got tangled in the Alps timeline and I want to untangle it...just a bit xD And as we know... Even a little bit helps.

Thank you very much in advance for your contributions guys! You'd help out a lot! Maybe we could even expand on the wiki just a bit by your commissions! I'll upload them if you're ok with it!

shallot · 05 Feb 2021, 16:34

I can get these pictures for you in a bit - but I can tell you for certain that the tactile leaf (at least in a NeXT Non-ADB board) is not the same as in Salmon/Ivory - there's no hole. They look functionally identical to those in SKCM Cream but the spring weight is heavier. My current thought is that Black is to Cream as Salmon is to Orange, but that's just a personal theory.

Lynx_Carpathica · 05 Feb 2021, 16:45

shallot wrote: 05 Feb 2021, 16:34 I can get these pictures for you in a bit - but I can tell you for certain that the tactile leaf is not the same as in Salmon/Ivory - there's no hole. They look functionally identical to those in SKCM Cream but the spring weight is heavier. My current thought is that Black is to Cream as Salmon is to Orange, but that's just a personal theory.

What generations do yours come from? What are the datecodes of the keyboard that comes with them?

shallot · 05 Feb 2021, 18:25

Lynx_Carpathica wrote: 05 Feb 2021, 16:45
shallot wrote: 05 Feb 2021, 16:34 I can get these pictures for you in a bit - but I can tell you for certain that the tactile leaf is not the same as in Salmon/Ivory - there's no hole. They look functionally identical to those in SKCM Cream but the spring weight is heavier. My current thought is that Black is to Cream as Salmon is to Orange, but that's just a personal theory.
What generations do yours come from? What are the datecodes of the keyboard that comes with them?

When I crack a switch tonight i'll also have the top case off and get you figures off the ICs

shallot · 05 Feb 2021, 18:34

1989 week 14:

Lynx_Carpathica · 05 Feb 2021, 18:53

it looks suspiciously like Salmon tactile leaves, and doesn't look like the later black ones. Can you please tell me if it has lubricant on the slider? It Judging by the color, it has. You can wipe it away a bit of with a finger. make sure not to wipe it on the side rails.
Even the oranges have holes... wonder what's the porpuse...

shallot · 06 Feb 2021, 01:11

they're shot for shot identical to SKCM Cream 4-tab tactile leaves to the point I got them confused. I'm not sure if it's factory lube or dirt but I definitely wiped something off it

Lynx_Carpathica · 06 Feb 2021, 01:53

If it is a film that covers the entirety of the slider - it was lube.

shallot · 06 Feb 2021, 23:34

then yup, factory lubed

Lynx_Carpathica · 07 Feb 2021, 20:27

Thank you for your contribution. I'll add it to the Wiki.

Polecat · 07 Feb 2021, 23:47

Two examples from my collection. Left is NeXT ABP, circa 1992, pine black. Right is Dell AT101W, circa 2001?, bamboo black. I know it sounds too late for SKCM, but the Dell has a case date of "01", and black bamboo Alps-branded SKCM switches.

I have a couple black SKBM boards also, but those probably aren't of interest.

mode1ace · 08 Feb 2021, 09:08

I have some much later pine blacks from a new logo dell AT102, and the slider is most definitely unlubed, I can take some pics later if you'd like?

Lynx_Carpathica · 08 Feb 2021, 10:15

Sure. I'll upload them to the wiki as well if you're ok with it.
The SKBM's color looks like as if it was lubed but that's actually not the case i guess xD The lubed switches look like this IRL as this SKBM slider looks on this pic. I don't think that'd be the case since my late pine ivories are not lubed either.

EDIT: Polecat: How close do they feel to Salmons?

Polecat · 08 Feb 2021, 17:40

Lynx_Carpathica wrote: 08 Feb 2021, 10:15 Sure. I'll upload them to the wiki as well if you're ok with it.
The SKBM's color looks like as if it was lubed but that's actually not the case i guess xD The lubed switches look like this IRL as this SKBM slider looks on this pic. I don't think that'd be the case since my late pine ivories are not lubed either.

EDIT: Polecat: How close do they feel to Salmons?

Not sure who you're replying to on the first paragraph. My photos are not wiki quality but you're welcome to post them. But both examples are SKCM, not SKBM. Definitely no lube on either one. Like most blacks I've tried these bind and stick, and both keyboards are original and (uh, squeaky) clean. The only salmon board I have is an Apple M0116, which is much smoother.

The wiki does say that the Dell AT101W was made as late as 2001, so mine must be one of the last. It's black (dark gray) and came with a server originally, so not a consumer item by then.

Lynx_Carpathica · 08 Feb 2021, 23:07

Sorry but I don't care about SKBM. XD So yes, definietly SKCM.
Binding can't be caused by the tactile leaves, or can it?

Polecat · 09 Feb 2021, 04:06

Lynx_Carpathica wrote: 08 Feb 2021, 23:07 Sorry but I don't care about SKBM. XD So yes, definietly SKCM.
Binding can't be caused by the tactile leaves, or can it?

I only bought the two SKBM boards because they were factory USB/ANSI and will take other Alps switches directly. More projects that I'll never get around to probably. I don't know why the NeXT and Dell are binding, but those are just parts donors, I don't expect to use the switches.

Lynx_Carpathica · 10 Feb 2021, 19:50

Polecat wrote: 09 Feb 2021, 04:06
Lynx_Carpathica wrote: 08 Feb 2021, 23:07 Sorry but I don't care about SKBM. XD So yes, definietly SKCM.
Binding can't be caused by the tactile leaves, or can it?
I only bought the two SKBM boards because they were factory USB/ANSI and will take other Alps switches directly. More projects that I'll never get around to probably. I don't know why the NeXT and Dell are binding, but those are just parts donors, I don't expect to use the switches.

Try replacing the top housing and the slider and see if the problem originates from the tactile leaf.

Polecat · 11 Feb 2021, 02:43

Lynx_Carpathica wrote: 10 Feb 2021, 19:50
Try replacing the top housing and the slider and see if the problem originates from the tactile leaf.

Thanks, but I'm a clicky switch user, no interest in tactiles. If someone wants to play with the black Alps switches I'll be happy to trade for something I can use.