Can't make up my mind - Blues, Reds, Browns, Blacks...

[ne0phyte]

Hey,

this is my first post after reading here for a while.
About a year ago I decided to get a mechanical keyboard and since I played most of the time I got a Noppoo Choc Mini with MX Black switches. I've been typing on the Blacks for a year now and I am totally used to them. The first week was awful, but by now its not exhausting to type on them for 10+ hours for me anymore.

But... on the long run I regret that I got such a weird layout and I am about to buy a normal (but tenkeyless) keyboard because programming is a real pita on the noppoo mini
I will most likely get a Filco Majestouch 2 or a Filco Majestouch 2 Ninja (god I love those letterings on the front).

I just can't decide whether I should get another keyboard with Blacks, the Filco with Reds or maybe Brown/Blue.
As from what I read the linear Reds are better for typing than Blacks. I don't plan to play with the new keyboard and I bottom out anyway so... MX Reds or MX Blues?

From the few tries on a Razer BlackWidow in the store (and countless youtube videos) I love the sound and feel of Blues, but I am comfodrtable with Blacks now (and Red should probably be even better?) so I don't know if it's worth it to try the Blues for programming.

Sorry for the wall of text, but I spent countless hours on reading and youtube videos already

[Icarium]

That's okay, we don't have an answer anyway. There are some made up rules like "blues and browns are better for typing" or "reds and blacks are better for gaming" due to marginal issues with hysteresis and some unproven claims about tactility being good for typing.

The only thing that helps is trying out stuff and even that is hard because you might have to try for a really long time to get used to all the actuation points and bottom-out depth and so on.

[ne0phyte]

So the short answer is: buy more keyboards until you find one you like?

Thats the problem. I will probably order a Cherry G80-3000 with blues on amazon and send it back after a week.
I hate to do that but I can't afford buying several 80€+ keyboards (the Filco alone is around 170€ here)

[Icarium]

It gets worse, the switch isn't the only factor contributing to the keyfeel. Build quality - for example - seems to have significant influence.

Blues are considered to be quite loud by many people so maybe you should take that into account.

Where are you located? Maybe you could visit somebody or borrow a board.

[Ascaii]

Take a look at the try before you buy section and sign up for one of the sinklists...they are your best bet to try different switches without having tp spend lots of money.

[bhtooefr]

Or, quality keyboards tend to have good resale value. So, you can buy a keyboard, try it out for a while, and if you don't like it, sell it.

Honestly, I think browns are pretty pointless (they're nearly linear, on the ones I've typed on), and I don't like linear switches, so I'd get the blues.

Reds, you know what they're going to feel like, except they're not as stiff as blacks. (A red is a black with the spring from a brown or blue.)

Blues are going to feel quite a bit different, and their problems generally don't affect typing. (Gaming, they can be really weird - I prefer to game on buckling spring over blues (although I also prefer to type on buckling spring over blues). It's not hysteresis, buckling spring has a ton of that and it's fine, rather, it's how the hysteresis actually occurs on blues.)

[ne0phyte]

I live in Germany (I can easily get to Hamburg).

Yeah I know the blues are pretty loud.. I don't mind that, but at night my parents next door do D:
Even my blacks are pretty loud when I bottom out, I will probably get o-rings for the Noppoo Choc soon.

Oh and I just saw that you can order samples (blue, red, black, brown, different o-rings and some caps) from wasdkeyoards for just $8 - I doubt a single key is enough to decide whether or not to get a full keyboard though.

Will have a look at the sinklists. Thanks for your answers!

EDIT: @ bhtooefr: Yeah thats what I thought about browns as well. I love the blacks and will continue to use the Choc Mini for gaming so I would either get blues or blacks (maybe reds, but I guess I will bottom out even worse).

[Ascaii]

If youre ever in Berlin I can let you try a bunch of stuff.

[hq1ify]

Get at least the sample pack from WASD first. Or Topre

[ne0phyte]

Already ordered one. First of all to try the different switches and rings and then to make a keychain out of one of the switches

[RC-1140]

Also if you get to Kiel once in a while, you might try some stuff as well. Definitely not as much as at Ascaii, but better than nothing.

[7bit]

Color does not matter. If in doubt, just take reds or clears.

Please order switches here:
CherryMX.

[vivalarevolución]

For what it's worth, the Reds are extremely light to the touch. I have Cherry Black keyboard and Cherry Red keyboard, and they both took some getting used to. One thing to consider with the Reds is you need to be a very accurate typist because if you accidentally hit another key, the keyboard will register the keystroke very easily.

But really, everybody has a personal preference and you can't know for sure unless you try them all out in person. And that means finding good keyboard friend or buying a bunch of these things.

[TDub]

Like everyone keeps saying, its all about personal preference. The sample bag is a good start, but I find it hard to determine if I like a switch without typing on a full board. Keycaps, plate mounting or pcb mounting and build quality also change the sound and feel of the keyboard quite a bit. I like plate over pcb mounting, because it makes the whole keyboard feel more solid. Others prefer pcb mounting because it feels a little softer to type on.

I am not sure if you will like reds if you like blacks. I have a Filco with reds and I presonally feel they are to light for typing.

If you are having noise issues, orings definitely help, I got mine from imsto at geekhack, which is a lot cheaper than wasd (I also live in Germany, shipping was pretty fast).

Also: Don't get the Blackwidow, it was my first mechanical keyboard (before I discovered Deskthority & Geekhack) and it is now sitting in a corner partially disassembled. Way overpriced and only 2kro...

[ne0phyte]

I love my blacks and as far as I can tell the feel and sound of blues so I will most likely get either blacks or blues.

I definitely won't buy the blackwidow. I heard that the quality is pretty bad (keys getting stuck and overall sturdiness) and it has extra macro keys, a numpad and a pretty big bezel.
Since I really don't need macro keys and the numpad I want a lean (tenkeyless) keyboard for typing / programming only.

Oh and I know there are some really old keyboards around here at work. Most of them are Cherry G80 with blues, some blacks and I even saw a Model M once
...I just have to explain that I need to try out their keyboards

[ne0phyte]

Sorry for double posting, but this is kind of a bump, too.

I had an even better idea. I asked the guy who manages all the stuff in the basement and he left me alone down there with 3 huge boxes full of old keyboard :D

So I just tried several Cherry G80 with clears, blacks and blues for 30 minutes and if I'm lucky I can get one for free.
I really like the blues and there are some in good condition.

In case they let me buy one (for testing the blues at home) how much do you think are those old G80s worth?
This one for example was in a really good condition:

[TDub]

I think it would depend on the switch. Vintage blacks are very sought after, newer blacks on the other hand are very cheap on ebay. Clears are also very popular and hard to find outside of cherries. Also the older cherries have much better build quality then the new ones and it also depends on the keycaps, doubleshots make it more valuable and if it has dyesubs the price is crazy:
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Cherry-G81-3000- ... 460a359c12
(and that is with the crappy g81 switches, not cherry mx)

But they don't know that so I would say try and get them for like 10-20 euros. If they offer you to buy as many as you want of the old unused keyboards, I am pretty sure others on this forum would be interessted too (I know I am).

[ne0phyte]

Hmm I'll ask, but I doubt they will sell them all. We still have many people typing on those old keyboards (whereas the fujitsu standard keyboards die all the time hehe).

[domin8r]

Be sure to give each keyboard a proper try.. maybe even a few days if that's possible.
Each switch takes a bit to get used to and you might not appreciate your perfect switch right away.

[ne0phyte]

omg omg omg!

I just found 2 keyboard geeks here at work AND I got the Cherry G80 with blues for free and might get more (clears and blacks) soon!

Aaand I noticed something really weird:
The article number is Cherry G80-3000LPMDE/01. According to the wiki:
- G80 = MX switches
- 3000
- L = Lasered PBT or POM
- P = MX Black
- M = ?
- DE = German

But the switches are blue, not black

[The_Ed]

P has always been browns for me. But I buy POS boards which don't generally follow the naming conventions. A 3000P with blues is indeed weird.

[ne0phyte]

Maybe the board or case was switched some day?
Here are some pictures http://imgur.com/a/MncZd

[TDub]

Well they naming doesn't always match the switches. I have an LQCDE = Clears like the wiki says, bought an LQEDE thinking more clears! but LQEDE has blacks (official cherry documentation also says linear). It appears they are inconsistent when it comes to the naming.

[Ascaii]

Actually, P stands for blue on newer g80-3000 boards, ive had about 30 of those.

[kbdfr]

[…]

Others are in a better position to answer your posts, but I have two remarks:
- you're lucky
- I had to laugh aloud when reading your signature

[ne0phyte]

I opened it to clean it and there is a sticker on the board saying "G80-3000LSMDE". So I guess they just put a the board into another case