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by wcass
18 Feb 2020, 20:57
Forum: Group buys
Topic: F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
Replies: 4517
Views: 507100

Re: F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards

daijoubu wrote:
18 Feb 2020, 02:57
wcass, it would make sense if the old is 5.5u, so that the other key would be a 1.5u instead of a 1.25u.

At what point did you measure the spacebar? At the bottom length?
Yes, flat across the base of the cap.
by wcass
18 Feb 2020, 01:26
Forum: Group buys
Topic: F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
Replies: 4517
Views: 507100

Re: F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards

So, "old" is slightly smaller than "new". Do you have a caliper?
Perhaps "old" is 5.5u (104.5 mm nominal) and "new" is 5.75u (109.25 mm)?
I am not sure which one i have, but it measures 104.8
by wcass
31 Jan 2020, 06:45
Forum: Workshop
Topic: A Smaller Xwhatsit
Replies: 90
Views: 7767

Re: A Smaller Xwhatsit

The files for USB-C.
As stated, the connector is larger so some things needed to move around. I had to move the Reset switch to the back.
xwhatsit USB-C.png
xwhatsit USB-C.png (54.89 KiB) Viewed 363 times
by wcass
30 Jan 2020, 02:23
Forum: Workshop
Topic: A Smaller Xwhatsit
Replies: 90
Views: 7767

Re: A Smaller Xwhatsit

i just realized that the width changed. i am sure there was some reason for it, but ... i have no idea why that happened.
by wcass
30 Jan 2020, 02:02
Forum: Workshop
Topic: A Smaller Xwhatsit
Replies: 90
Views: 7767

Re: A Smaller Xwhatsit

I actually did design a version with USB-C connector and one with USB breakout pads. The USB-C connector is larger (in one demension) than micro USB and requires an additional resistor, so i had to move some stuff around and i think that C6 was eliminated because of that. I think i determined that i...
by wcass
29 Jan 2020, 04:08
Forum: Workshop
Topic: A Smaller Xwhatsit
Replies: 90
Views: 7767

Re: A Smaller Xwhatsit

I thought i posted these somewhere, but maybe not. I'm not sure i found the right BOM (it has been 3.5 years). I think this is it, but not sure. Location Type Form Factor C1;C2; 30pF; 0805; C3; 4.7uF; 0805; C4;C7;C8;C9;C10;C11;C12; 0.1uF; 0805; C5; 1uF; 0805; R1;R2; 22; 0805; R3;R6; 20K; 0805; R4;R7...
by wcass
28 Jan 2020, 02:48
Forum: Workshop
Topic: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)
Replies: 2093
Views: 130015

Re: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

The dfx file is good to send for plasma/water jet cut from metal. Then put the metal through a slip roll to put the curve in.
Slip rollers are common in HVAC shops.
by wcass
17 Oct 2019, 05:32
Forum: Workshop
Topic: 65% Model F – Open Group Build
Replies: 51
Views: 5460

Re: 65% Model F – Open Group Build

I finally found my cheat sheet with post position measurements on it. There is about 1 mm between caps, so the actual caps are about 1 mm smaller than this. It is marked to .001 precision, but don't believe that. If you are off by 0.1, everything will work fine and no one will notice. I would not be...
by wcass
15 Oct 2019, 19:55
Forum: Workshop
Topic: 65% Model F – Open Group Build
Replies: 51
Views: 5460

Re: 65% Model F – Open Group Build

i think it is worth trying - make the bottom row pads slightly wide to accommodate as many different layouts as we can. We would need one more pin for a new column, though. Any suggestions as to what pin to use? And what pins to use for the TP option - with consideration for routing? Though i sugges...
by wcass
10 Oct 2019, 20:01
Forum: Workshop
Topic: 65% Model F – Open Group Build
Replies: 51
Views: 5460

Re: 65% Model F – Open Group Build

We could make a 3u space bar with posts equivalent to 1.5+1.5 and adjust some things a bit.
Then all of these become available ...
bottom row.png
bottom row.png (6.54 KiB) Viewed 3333 times
by wcass
09 Oct 2019, 20:55
Forum: Workshop
Topic: 65% Model F – Open Group Build
Replies: 51
Views: 5460

Re: 65% Model F – Open Group Build

My fault for not explaining it well. The key cap "value" is not so much a problem - it is possition. Right now, there are 3 possible configurations; ISO Enter and the cap left of that, ANSI Enter and the cap above that, or 1u + 1.25u + 1.5u on the row above. I could "free up" one pad by saying that ...
by wcass
09 Oct 2019, 20:21
Forum: Workshop
Topic: 65% Model F – Open Group Build
Replies: 51
Views: 5460

Re: 65% Model F – Open Group Build

Right now, Enter plus back-slash are using 3 pads; Enter covers two pads, but only uses one (same) pad for sensing in ISO and ANSI config, the second for stabilization, and the third for back-slash - second and third swap depending on ISO or ANSI. Hypothetically, i could use the same column and row ...
by wcass
09 Oct 2019, 01:51
Forum: Workshop
Topic: 65% Model F – Open Group Build
Replies: 51
Views: 5460

Re: 65% Model F – Open Group Build

Split spacebar was seriously considered. It was not selected for 2.5 reasons; Code key caps are rare (you can't order them from Unicomp); the "small" spacebar is 5.75u wide (could not fill this space with just Code key caps); and we have exactly 70 pads already (5x14 matrix - so would need to activa...
by wcass
08 Oct 2019, 03:28
Forum: Workshop
Topic: 65% Model F – Open Group Build
Replies: 51
Views: 5460

Re: 65% Model F – Open Group Build

It may be possible, but it would probably have to be flat. Most keyboards mount the switches flat and use different key cap profiles on each row to give contour. Buckling spring key caps all have the same profile and they mount the switches on a curved plate to give contour. I also don't think that ...
by wcass
07 Oct 2019, 02:29
Forum: Workshop
Topic: 65% Model F – Open Group Build
Replies: 51
Views: 5460

Re: 65% Model F – Open Group Build

The pad card PCB would be 0.8 mm thick - how brittle this is - is worth learning. The bottom plate would be 3d printed, so non-conductive. The smaller footprint for capacitive pads is good to know - i am also working on an MF re-design to take advantage of CommonSense larger matrix support (6x20 mat...
by wcass
06 Oct 2019, 16:53
Forum: Workshop
Topic: 65% Model F – Open Group Build
Replies: 51
Views: 5460

65% Model F – Open Group Build

Manisteinn and I have been chatting since July. I really liked the 3d printed case he designed for a model F keypad and I wanted to test out a few new pad card and controller ideas, so I suggested that we collaborate. Well, we are getting to the point where we need to purchase parts, so I thought it...
by wcass
08 Aug 2019, 02:56
Forum: Workshop
Topic: [Done] CommonSense: matrix LCR meter with a HID interface
Replies: 545
Views: 54425

Re: [Done] CommonSense controller - better capsense!

This is not xwhatsit which has custom hardware - this is a Lego set of standard bricks. You can build, like, WORLDS from those - but it requires imagination, skill, and some thinking. Great analogy. Might i suggest that the part of the keyboard community that can do this - help create more document...
by wcass
02 Jun 2019, 17:34
Forum: Workshop
Topic: Alternative capsense patterns testing
Replies: 10
Views: 1056

Re: Alternative capsense patterns testing

The testing discussed here was done on two layer PCBs. Four layer PCBs are not much more expensive - and could benefit from more development. The top two layers of 4 layer board are 1/10 the thickness of 2 layer board, so signal strength should be much better. The third layer is well placed for a gr...
by wcass
02 Jun 2019, 07:01
Forum: Workshop
Topic: Alternative capsense patterns testing
Replies: 10
Views: 1056

Re: Alternative capsense patterns testing

maybe you are forgetting that the metal back plate (directly under the pad card) is connected to ground.
by wcass
18 Apr 2019, 21:18
Forum: Workshop
Topic: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)
Replies: 2093
Views: 130015

Re: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

It is not about one or the other, it is about options. Our plan is to design "keyboards" (not "a keyboard"). But some features - such as "controller on pad card" and "bezel-less layout" will be very difficult or impossible with a curved back-plate. It is possible to make a buckling spring HHKB (abou...
by wcass
28 Mar 2019, 17:46
Forum: Group buys
Topic: F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
Replies: 4517
Views: 507100

Re: F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards

I expect that there will be a secondary market; most likely here, GH, and redit. You could probably go to the forums now and post something like "want to trade 'Ellipse key caps'? ... i order blue, you order dark grey and we trade modifiers"
by wcass
21 Mar 2019, 20:18
Forum: Workshop
Topic: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)
Replies: 2093
Views: 130015

Re: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

As for the pin or buttress debate, i like to use neither. The purpose of the pin or buttress is to prevent the barrel (and key cap) from rotating around the "chimney". What works just as well and i think is more aesthetically pleasing is to use something under the top plate that prevents the rectang...
by wcass
21 Mar 2019, 19:49
Forum: Workshop
Topic: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)
Replies: 2093
Views: 130015

Re: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

Half holes at the back is good, but might impact lateral stability of the pivot plate. How about immediately forward of the fulcrum? Change in capacitance is generated by change in distance between the pivot plate and card pad. So it should be that the most impactful bit of the pivot plate is the bi...
by wcass
21 Mar 2019, 02:54
Forum: Workshop
Topic: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)
Replies: 2093
Views: 130015

Re: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

if the rows are offset by a half unit (as they are for most of of a "standard" 60%) do the quarter-rounds form round holes? It kinda looks like this would work for non-stagger and quarter-stagger but half-stagger maybe not.
by wcass
12 Feb 2019, 01:28
Forum: Group buys
Topic: F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards
Replies: 4517
Views: 507100

Re: F62+F77 orders now open! New Kishsaver+Industrial Model F Keyboards

I suppose i should order parts to make more of these ...
by wcass
04 Feb 2019, 01:55
Forum: Workshop
Topic: wcass' Compact SSK: a review, reverse engineer, teardown, geek-out.
Replies: 45
Views: 3938

Re: wcass' Compact SSK: a review, reverse engineer, teardown, geek-out.

I went to the Workshop today to look up DMA's Bluetooth Common Sense and found this. Thanks red for the review. I knew that a lot of folks would not care for the layout. I posted that back in September 2015 under the topic "Post a picture of your ideal keyboard layout!". I couldn't consider myself a...
by wcass
02 Feb 2019, 00:47
Forum: Workshop
Topic: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)
Replies: 2093
Views: 130015

Re: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

I let them know that i would be happy to work with them anytime. I am also trying to get to more meetups and give folks a "hands-on" with the CSSK. It is very impressive in person. Someone from here did attempt to work with Unicomp - M'er Forever mocked up a modern SSK interpretation, and recall th...
by wcass
02 Feb 2019, 00:25
Forum: Workshop
Topic: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)
Replies: 2093
Views: 130015

Re: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

Do M barrel frames really work with F flippers? If so, good job I’ve got a few SSK sized spares. Grabbed them before MF was even an idea. Yes, except .... Reinforcement of the space bar stabilizer hold-down extends into the flipper area on some (not all) barrel frames. This is not an issue with the...
by wcass
01 Feb 2019, 04:07
Forum: Workshop
Topic: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)
Replies: 2093
Views: 130015

Re: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

I let them know that i would be happy to work with them anytime. I am also trying to get to more meetups and give folks a "hands-on" with the CSSK. It is very impressive in person.
by wcass
01 Feb 2019, 02:06
Forum: Workshop
Topic: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)
Replies: 2093
Views: 130015

Re: (Model MF) Remodeling the Model M (aka.. the Mara)

Model M barrels are the same as Model F barrels - so the barrel frame and case of any Model M can be used. You just need a new pad card, pivot plates, and controller. The discrete barrels of the AT, XT, and 122 allows rearranging the switches into ... pretty much any layout (just like Cherry/Alps) l...

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